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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - Suggestions/Bug Reports - HTML |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1104/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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Originally posted by HyperHackerI never said it crashed for me, i just said that I HATE IT. It's even more immature to advertise FF just because you hate "wind0ze" (yet you use it) and any "micro$oft" software. Sad.  |
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HyperLamer <||bass> and this was the soloution i thought of that was guarinteed to piss off the greatest amount of people Sesshomaru Tamaranian Level: 118 Posts: 3114/8210 EXP: 18171887 For next: 211027 Since: 03-15-04 From: Canada, w00t! LOL FAD Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Emptyeye Real American Level: 67 Posts: 1397/2273 EXP: 2488421 For next: 104451 Since: 05-24-04 From: I DUNNOOOOOOOO!! Since last post: 9 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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| As much as I love Firefox, two things irk me about it: 1. The fact that it occasionally just stops loading pages when it finds something it doesn't like (as opposed to doing what it can and working around what it can't) irks me. 2. So does the fact that it doesn't fully display long image alt tags (A W3C STANDARD ARE IMAGE TAGS, MIND YOU), at least not by default, while IE does. Of course, for the rare instances I need IE to look at something, there's the IEView extension.  |
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Kasumi-Astra Administrator Level: 62  Posts: 1178/1867 EXP: 1971846 For next: 12840 Since: 03-15-04 From: Reading, UK Uni: Sheffield, UK Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 12 hours |
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| I've never had any of the problems that have been mentioned with Firefox. The browser is a joy to use and makes surfing a whole lot easier in many ways. I'll have to back up Acmlm on this one, he really hit the nail on the head. Many webmasters who run Acmlmboards on their servers like the system because it's so much easier to maintain and mod than the other free PHP / MySQL offerings. It's not bogged down with every feature imaginable like the other ones. It's just got the ones that count. Even though you only see the HTML outputted, just because it looks sloppy it doesn't mean that it's not efficient. We've already demonstrated that it shrinks the fiile sizes by approximately a third (looking at the difference in line length), and seeing as it works in Firefox, IE and Opera 99.999999% of the time, you couldn't possibly have a good reason to complain about this. Unless you're hardcore and use text based browsers, that is  I agree that the W3C standards for XHTML are in the best interests for a formal website that would need to be read in mulitple browsers, but let's face it: Out of all the billions of pages of HTML code that makes up the internet, how many are written to a high standard? THAT is the reason why the big three browsers are so forgiving. You simply wouldn't be able to surf without tripping up over problematic pages. |
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Narf Hi Tuvai! (reregistering while banned) Level: 16  Posts: 17/100 EXP: 17634 For next: 2622 Since: 12-26-04 Since last post: 22 hours Last activity: 14 hours |
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Originally posted by Retro-KasumiFilesize doesn't mean jack shit. I got a ton of 100+ KB PHP files on my server and the fact that they're so big doesn't affect speed, resources or anything at all. It's the output that matters. A 200 KB PHP file with efficient coding and HTML in it, is 'smaller' than a 300 Byte PHP file with a loop that spits out hundreds or thousands of HTML code snippets. And consider why browsers have been made so 'forgiving' in the first place, it's because people can't even use fucking HTML right, apperantly right from the moment it was 'invented', and since there were crap editors such as Dreamweaver and Frontpage. |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1105/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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Originally posted by HyperHackerFind it yourself. Originally posted by NarfUh yeah, some people (like me) just find the w3c standards stupid. And file size does matter for some people, mind you. |
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Narf Hi Tuvai! (reregistering while banned) Level: 16 Posts: 18/100 EXP: 17634 For next: 2622 Since: 12-26-04 Since last post: 22 hours Last activity: 14 hours |
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Originally posted by knuckThat's why I make a lot of money as a webdesigner/scripter, and you don't. Originally posted by knuckI know a lot of people prefer 10 small files over one huge file, but that's just subjective; a matter of taste and preference. But the 'heavyness' of a script does not have anything to do with filesize. (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 04:03 PM) (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 04:03 PM) |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1106/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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Originally posted by NarfUh, what do you know about my life? That's right. But hey, have fun with your <  |
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dan Snap Dragon Level: 43  Posts: 390/782 EXP: 534516 For next: 30530 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 20 hours Last activity: 14 hours |
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Originally posted by knuckOriginally posted by NarfUh, what do you know about my life? That's right. Because he is a web designer, he knows that you are not because of your ignorance of why the XHTML standards are a good thing. On the topic of filesize though, it's been my experience though, that converting a site to XHTML can actually decrease the filesize of pages. I think I've seen a few articles where semi-complex sites like this one, once the site has been rewritten to the conform to the new standards, the filesize has actually went down. |
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Narf Hi Tuvai! (reregistering while banned) Level: 16 Posts: 19/100 EXP: 17634 For next: 2622 Since: 12-26-04 Since last post: 22 hours Last activity: 14 hours |
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| I know nothing about your life, not that I really care in the first place. But the fact is, I stick to those stupid W3C standards, writing HTML as it's supposed to, and I 'have fun' using <br /> instead of <br>, <img src="image.bla" alt="description" /> instead of <img src=image.jpg> and more of that stupid XHTML, and I get a lot of money for that because my websites look how they're supposed to in all browsers. I highly doubt you do. Of course I have fun with it. =) Oh yeah, 2 years ago I had the exact same opinion on XHTML as you have right now, and only now I realize what a dumbass I was when it came to writing scripts and webpages. (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 04:29 PM) |
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Gavin Fuzzy Rhinoceruses don't play games. They fucking charge your ass. Level: 43  Posts: 450/799 EXP: 551711 For next: 13335 Since: 03-15-04 From: IL, USA Since last post: 13 hours Last activity: 13 hours |
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Originally posted by Retro-Kasumi no... but the underlying code that i have studied generally isn't the most efficient i've ever seen to put it that way.
i'm not "complaining", i merely assumed that the description for this forum was applicable to the posts that should be contained within: "Do you have comments or suggestions about the site, or this message board? Or anything else to ask about? This is where you should post about this." My question fits in this forum, unless you have another suggestion.
no, THAT attitude is why browsers are so forgiving, because people are too lazy to use something how it was intended. That aside, the output of the board isn't just some 16 year-old's junk website, it's PHP based forum software, it's a specialized case. I was merely wondering if the current board developers were going to be putting any emphasis on using HTML correctly, it seems like not, which is unfortunate as the change would not be in any was difficult. Originally posted by knuckUh yeah, some people (like me) just find the w3c standards stupid. And file size does matter for some people, mind you. and people like you are breaking the internet. please stop. |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1107/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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Originally posted by danNot everyone have the same opinion. The fact that i don't like xhtml won't stop me from being a webdesigner. Originally posted by GavinThat coming from you. |
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Narf Hi Tuvai! (reregistering while banned) Level: 16 Posts: 20/100 EXP: 17634 For next: 2622 Since: 12-26-04 Since last post: 22 hours Last activity: 14 hours |
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| The fact that i don't like xhtml won't stop me from being a webdesigner. You, a webdesigner? Don't make me laugh. If you'd ever became a webdesigner, you'd increase the ammount of pages improperly put together, thus breaking the Internet, as Gavin said. The only clients you'd get would be dumbasses that want a site that just works properly for Internet Explorer 6 on a Windows system. Not to forget, you're a copy & paste board lurk person, I recall you asking me on IRC and AIM how to fuck up this board after I found out the document.cookies exploit (Oh yeah knuck, you should know who I am now  ). You're not quite a fit person to be walking around with a lot of knowledge about programming and websites in general, you'd fuck up other websites when you'd get the chance to.(edited by Narf on 02-03-05 04:52 PM) (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 04:54 PM) (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 04:59 PM) (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 05:05 PM) (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 05:10 PM) |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1108/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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The fact that i don't like xhtml won't stop me from being a webdesigner. <- put 'someone' instead of 'i' and 'that person' instead of 'me'. Not a hard thing to do, srsly.Originally posted by NarfHmm if you are Laxidman, i never talked to you by AIM. Then again, i never asked Laxidman for document.cookie exploit, so i can only think about Tuvai, but he told me how to do it. ;[ And hell yes, if/when i had/have knowledge about websites, i'll go around fucking up other websites when i get a chance to. And? |
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Narf Hi Tuvai! (reregistering while banned) Level: 16 Posts: 21/100 EXP: 17634 For next: 2622 Since: 12-26-04 Since last post: 22 hours Last activity: 14 hours |
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| When do you finally get the clue that I don't care and that it's completely irrelevant how many people are messy HTML writers that give a shit about standards? They suck, period. Standards are there for a reason, everything has standards. When laying a pipe system in a building the pipe system has to suit specific standards. When making an electricity network you have to stick to standards. And the same goes for websites. The only difference is, for things like pipe systems and elecriticy there are companies that check on pipe works/elecricity networks, and for websites specificly, there isn't. That's why there are so many morons that stick standards up their fat, lazy arses and make ugly websites full of sloppy copy & paste Javascript that doesn't work in browsers that are NOT Internet Eplorer 6.0. Oh, and: And hell yes, if/when i had/have knowledge about websites, i'll go around fucking up other websites when i get a chance to. And? I guess that tells us enough about you, enough said. (edited by Narf on 02-03-05 05:51 PM) |
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DarkSlaya POOOOOOOOOOOORN! Level: 88 Posts: 3355/4249 EXP: 6409254 For next: 241410 Since: 05-16-04 From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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| I read this thread, and saw standards....standards....standards. We're on the web, such things exist but aren't respected. Who does, maybe some of you do. But in programming, most will write non-standard code. They don't give a fuck, and for a reason. It takes alot less time to write a non standard thing than one that meets them (in general). Both give the same results, but one is faster to write (and don't say it isn't true, I speak from experience. So before whining (Note that I'm not talking about you, Gavin), just think alittle. Do you see anything fucked up on this board? No, unless you use an outdated browser (which you shouldn't, and I know I wouldn't update for people using outdated things , full of security holes and such). And the fact that sloppy HTML is actually displayed in most situations makes me use it (even if it isn't as sloppy as most use it). I also have to agree with knuck, about the thing that everyone has his opinion. I have been making websites for 5 or 6 years and always thought those standards are stupid. All this bullshit of "use the correct thing", I just don't care. Go whine to those compagnies that don't use the standards, then go and say that people should use the stardards. (Note: Post not directed toward any person.... Actually, it may be in some way) |
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Black Lord Level: 34 Posts: 170/453 EXP: 235639 For next: 18012 Since: 03-15-04 From: Nebraska, what's a Nebraska Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 1 day |
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| We're on the web, such things exist but aren't respected. Who does, maybe some of you do. People don't respect standards in real life either, and what happens, they get fined, or sued, or both. I'm not saying that it should come to the same on the web. But the standards are a start at making a non-shitty internet experience. It takes alot less time to write a non standard thing than one that meets them (in general) I haven't noticed much of a difference in time myself... but I haven't gone on an all out designathon since I started using the standards myself either. |
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Gavin Fuzzy Rhinoceruses don't play games. They fucking charge your ass. Level: 43 Posts: 453/799 EXP: 551711 For next: 13335 Since: 03-15-04 From: IL, USA Since last post: 13 hours Last activity: 13 hours |
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Originally posted by Sex Change no. if you write "non-standardized" programming in any language equivilant of the underlying HTML for this very displayed page you are reading, the program won't even come closer to compiling/assembling/running. I look at the current standardization campaign as a drive to fix where HTML has gone wrong, and to get it to be used the way it was intended. honestly, i'm a lazy-ass bastard. i'm probably one of the laziest people you could ever met... but what is so hard about this?? It's just HTML, it's not like it's hard or time consuming to learn the proper way to write pages. |
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DarkSlaya POOOOOOOOOOOORN! Level: 88 Posts: 3360/4249 EXP: 6409254 For next: 241410 Since: 05-16-04 From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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Originally posted by Gavin I know it's not that hard. But there's one problem. Tell me: How do most people learn HTML? It's not uncommon that people learn by looking at one's page source. That one person page's source doesn't use valid html, the one who's learning doesn't know. And if you learnt by using a tutorial, you probably don't know about some things that you write that aren't 'valid'. All this to say that the best way to actually make people use proper HTML would be that the existing web pages change to valid code. And on the real topic, let's say that the board's html hasn't changed since the Era when IE ruled over every browsers. |
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FreeDOS Lava Lotus Wannabe-Mod :< Level: 59 Posts: 1059/1657 EXP: 1648646 For next: 24482 Since: 03-15-04 From: Seattle Since last post: 6 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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| It's not uncommon for people to make web pages in FrontPage. Does that make it right? No. Just because some people do it doesn't make it right. The recommendations by the W3C exist for the reason of being viewable in any browser, not for your creating enjoyment, but so others can enjoy the pages without a button going "OMG U NEEDZ IE TO VIEW THIS PAGE" (Go ahead and replace IE with any other single browser like Mozilla, Opera, Lynx, etc). |
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