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Lenophis

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Posted on 02-05-05 07:43 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by dan
They didn't rename the game retroactively. They renamed it at the time of release of the SNES version of Final Fantasy 3.

Dan: "It's ok for Nintendo to rename a game they didn't make to whatever they want, because they translated it. However, it's not ok for Squaresoft, original creator of the game, to fix said game, release it on a new system, with it's original name. Because we need to ridicule Squaresoft for fixing a mistake that Nintendo made."

Dan, you are basing this on the assumption that Squaresoft merely just ported it to the PSX. And for the most part it was. But you can't sit here and call it a direct port of the American version. Bugs were fixed, dialogue changed (as if it were re-translated), so you can't say with absolute certainty that they "retroactively renamed it." For all you know, it was a complete redoing of the original version, so stop with the guesswork.

I think this argument could go on to the end of time really. So, I'll be the one to bow out. (Mostly because neither side is budging an inch, and repeating the same arguments over and over get tiring)

I'm presenting the truth. You won't accept the truth. You say you base your logic on what Nintendo says, and the GoodSnes name? GoodSnes probably based the label on what Nintendo gave it. I'll even quote Shakespeare:
"A rose by any other name will smell just as sweet." The rose is in this case, is the original name, which is FF6. Which Nintendo renamed to fool morons (and since you are taking that bait, you are included in that list) and make them ignorant of the truth (and you've shown a good example of that as well). You have said that someone shouldn't just go and rename something on a whim, then why do you say that Nintendo can get away with it? Renaming is renaming, doesn't matter when it was done during production. Nintendo was wrong, the GoodSNES set naming was based on that wrong information, so guess what that makes you? Wrong on all accounts. And yet, you insist that Squaresoft is at fault....

But since you have shown ignorance, arguing with you is as pointless as arguing with anybody. Because "I cannot possibly be wrong, it's me." Even with the correct information, you refuse to accept it. "...he's just being an idiot about it."

That was my last try, if at this point you wish to "be an idiot" and still stand by your misguided logic, go ahead. Mod, I call you, close this. Since you seem to win "cuz I'm the mod."
drjayphd

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Posted on 02-05-05 11:54 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Chibi Gatomon
um can we get back on topic?


That ship has sailed LOOOONG ago, my fine feathered friend.

ANYWAY, as far as what you were asking, I'm certain there's different codes for v1.0 and v1.1.

(cracks open a beer and watches the Special Olympics)
Nebetsu

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Posted on 02-08-05 06:01 AM Link | Quote
Ok. So lets get the whole FF names thing straight so I'm not confused.


FF I (NES/PS/GBA)
FF II (NES/PS/GBA)
FF III (NES)
FF IV (SNES/PS) = American FF II (SNES)
FF V (SNES/PS)
FF VI (SNES/PS) = American FF III (SNES)
FF VII (PS)
FF VIII (PS)
FF IX (PS)
FF X (PS2)
FF X-2 (PS2)
FF XI (PS2)


That's right... right?
Vystrix Nexoth

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Posted on 02-08-05 06:33 AM Link | Quote
Nebetsu: that list is indeed correct. In addition:
  • FF1 was re-released on the MSX back in the day, with a few extra colors and such. I don't think it looks that great.
  • FF1 and FF2 were originally re-made and re-released on the WonderSwan Color (a portable console that was never released in America); the PlayStation and Game Boy Advance ports were based thereon.

Furthermore, none of the Game Boy "Final Fantasy" games are actually Final Fantasy games:
  • The "Final Fantasy Legend" games are part of the SaGa series, if I'm not mistaken.
  • "Final Fantasy Adventure" is actually Seiken Densetsu I ("Secret of Mana" is Seiken Densetsu II).

Final Fantasy Mystic Quest is noteworthy as being the only Final Fantasy game, to my knowledge, to be released in America before Japan. After the success of "Final Fantasy II" (FF4) in America, Square was originally going to release Final Fantasy V here (under the name "Final Fantasy Extreme" due to its difficulty compared to FF4, let alone the easytype version we got, which is a story in itself), but instead opted to develop a game specifically for the American audience. That game was Final Fantasy Mystic Quest. The Japanese audience, though, stuck out their collective bottom lips and stamped their collective feet, so Square translated it into Japanese and released it there, under the name "Final Fantasy USA".

Final Fantasy IV has the most convoluted story out of all the games. The original version (now known as the "Hardtype" version) was Japanese-only. Square later modified the game to make it easier (either you get more experience or don't need as much, I don't remember which), and released this "Final Fantasy IV Easytype", again only in Japan. When Square opted to translate it into English and release it to American audiences, they translated the Easytype version, and that became our "Final Fantasy II". Along the way, some parts of the game were culled away, such as Cecil's "Dark Wave" attack (which you can still see when he fights himself atop Mt. Ordeals), Rosa's "Prayer" command (which heals everyone by a small amount but with no MP cost), and such. These are not present in FF2US, but I don't remember whether they were present in FF4ET.

Anyhow, once Square decided to re-release FF4-FF6 on the PlayStation, they, as we know, used the original numbers this time around. Plus, with Final Fantasy IV, the translation and game were finally based on the original, "Hardtype" version.

The PlayStation re-releases of Final Fantasy II and Final Fantasy V mark the first time those games have officially been released in America (or Europe for that matter), along with the original "Hardtype" of Final Fantasy IV, as mentioned.

Final Fantasy III remains the only game that has not officially been released outside Japan.



[Edit] For reference, here's a table showing each of the Final Fantasy games, all ports thereof that I'm aware of, and the names under which they are known in Japan and America:

JapanAmericaSystem
Final FantasyFinal FantasyNES
---MSX
---WonderSwan Color
Final Fantasy II---NES
---WonderSwan Color
FF1 + FF2(untitled)---NES
F.F. Origins*Final Fantasy OriginsPlaystation
Dawn of SoulsDawn of SoulsGame Boy Advance
Final Fantasy III---NES
Final Fantasy IVHardtype---Super NES
---WonderSwan Color
Final Fantasy IVPlaystation
EasytypeFinal Fantasy IISuper NES
Final Fantasy USAFinal Fantasy Mystic QuestSuper NES
Final Fantasy V---Super NES
Final Fantasy VPlaystation
Final Fantasy VIFinal Fantasy IIISuper NES
Final Fantasy VIPlaystation
Final Fantasy VIIFinal Fantasy VIIPlaystation
Final Fantasy VIIIFinal Fantasy VIIIPlaystation
Final Fantasy IXFinal Fantasy IXPlaystation
Final Fantasy XFinal Fantasy XPlaystation2
Final Fantasy X-2Final Fantasy X-2Playstation2
Final Fantasy XIFinal Fantasy XIPlaystation2 & PC
Final Fantasy TacticsFinal Fantasy TacticsPlaystation
Final Fantasy Tactics AdvanceFinal Fantasy Tactics AdvanceGame Boy Advance


* Regarding the Playstation ports of Final Fantasy I and Final Fantasy II:
  • In Japan, they were released separately.
  • In Europe, they are on separate discs but are distributed together as "Final Fantasy Origins". It also marks the first time either game has officially been released in Europe.
  • In America, the two games are on a single disc as "Final Fantasy Origins". It marks the first time Final Fantasy II has officially been released there.


And, for completeness, the Game Boy "Final Fantasy" games, along with the other games in their respective series, for comparison:

JapanAmericaSystem
Makai Toushi SaGaFinal Fantasy LegendGame Boy
SaGa 2Final Fantasy Legend IIGame Boy
SaGa 3Final Fantasy Legend IIIGame Boy
SaGa 4Romancing SaGaSuper NES
SaGa 5Romancing SaGa IISuper NES
SaGa 6Romancing SaGa IIISuper NES
SaGa 7SaGa FrontierPlaystation
Seiken DensetsuFinal Fantasy AdventureGame Boy
Seiken Densetsu IISecret of ManaSuper NES
Seiken Densetsu III---Super NES
Seiken Densetsu IVLegend of ManaPlaystation


"Secret of Evermore" was Made in America

(edited by Vystrix Nexoth on 02-08-05 03:38 AM)
(edited by Vystrix Nexoth on 02-08-05 04:44 AM)
(edited by Vystrix Nexoth on 02-08-05 10:59 PM)
Colleen
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Posted on 02-08-05 07:51 AM Link | Quote
Yeah, the FF Legend games are all SaGa games. FFL1 is notable for having one of the WORST translations Square has ever produced... FFL2 was a bit better, FFL3 was decent.

The FFL1 translation is surprising given that the game included a decent long manual to boot. I think they spent more time on the manual than the game.

And didn't FF4 get a WS port?
Lenophis

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Posted on 02-08-05 07:57 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Colleen
And didn't FF4 get a WS port?

Indeed it did. And thank you VN for that table, even though some would choose to ignore it...

I'm surpised Tactics and every FF1, FF4, and FF6 hack aren't in that list! [/sarcasm]
Heian-794

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Posted on 02-09-05 02:37 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Vystrix Nexoth


And, for completeness, the Game Boy "Final Fantasy" games, along with the other games in their respective series, for comparison:

JapanAmericaSystem
SaGa 4Romancing SaGaSuper NES
SaGa 5Romancing SaGa IISuper NES
SaGa 6Romancing SaGa IIISuper NES
SaGa 7SaGa FrontierPlaystation

...

"Secret of Evermore" was Made in America
Vystrix Nexoth

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Posted on 02-10-05 04:17 AM Link | Quote
duly noted. I prepared a standalone page with the tables above: http://zero-soul.panicus.org/misc/ffgames.html - that should have the corrections mentioned.
Colleen
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Posted on 02-10-05 08:51 AM Link | Quote
If SoE was released in Japan, it was under a totally different name that didn't include the word "Evermore". I can't be bothered to check right now but I know it received multiple European released and an American release. I think that's it.
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