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| 0 user currently in World Affairs / Debate. |
| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - Teachers: Over- or Under-paid? |
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Zarathud Level: 12  Posts: 47/55 EXP: 7184 For next: 737 Since: 12-27-04 From: Terra, Sol. Since last post: 294 days Last activity: 294 days |
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| Don't be so damn lazy Ziff. Slavery was bad because it was forcing people to do things against their will. We commodify ourselves every time we get a job or go on contract for our skills. Commodification!=slavery. "Duh," as they say. You should know better. Nothing escapes economics. Not school, health care, the military, whatever. If you pretend that the standard rules that apply to every good and service somehow magically don't apply to this one, you're going end up with inefficiency. Period. Recognizing this fact doesn't make people any less human. (edited by Zarathud on 01-07-05 01:37 PM) |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99  Posts: 2299/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| You people have taken what Adam Smith proposed and destroyed it! People are not commodities. You are forcing people, against their will, to submit basic rights, like education and healthcare, to become private property. This is intrinsically evil. This is exactly what fascist Italy and Germany wanted. |
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Zarathud Level: 12 Posts: 49/55 EXP: 7184 For next: 737 Since: 12-27-04 From: Terra, Sol. Since last post: 294 days Last activity: 294 days |
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| "People are not commodities." This has actually been a straw man from the beginning and I can't believe I didn't explicitly point it out: it's not the children themselves that are commoditized, it's the education. Education and health care are services. Human time, effort and talent is indeed a commodity that people buy and sell every day. The entire economy is based on it. All I'm talking about is recognizing this fact and treating these goods and services (which are finite like everything else) as they actually are and then building as optimal a system of supply as we can manage on that assumption. "You are forcing people, against their will, to submit basic rights, like education and healthcare, to become private property." If you think about it for a moment rather than frothing, it might occur to you that 1) health care and education are not "rights", though we can argue over wether they should be, 2) nobody here is proposing depriving people of these things, only trying to provide them in what we think would be better ways, and 3) both theory and practice have shown that systems based on private property nearly always work better than ones based on a commons. "This is intrinsically evil." No such thing. "This is exactly what fascist Italy and Germany wanted." Okay, now do I get to invoke Godwin? |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 2308/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Nope. No relation to NAZIs or Hitler. The fascist German state exist prior to the announcement of the Enabling act. | |||
Generation Terrorist Mini Octorok Level: 7 Posts: 14/18 EXP: 1355 For next: 93 Since: 12-22-04 From: 100 steps forward, 99 steps back. Since last post: 279 days Last activity: 242 days |
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| Well, they do it cause they love kids and want to make the kids contribute to society one day. Or at least the good ones do. They are not "cool with it" in many places. In fact, last year, in my own school district, there was a 2 day period where teachers went on strike against the district office for not giving anyone a raise in TEN YEARS. And they still havent had the raise. Once again, they're weighing their career enjoyment against their monetary needs. We can complain about actors or football players making more money, but that's because they're not being paid in tax money. Tax money is finite, and it has to go to books, administration staff, custodians, custodial equipment, utilities, etc... Public schools are always scrounging for money (as I know, coming from a school in Northern Georgia), and generally don't have anything extra to give to teachers. I think somewhere along the line we're going to have to agree that there's nothing we can do given our present means, and that teachers aren't exactly getting minimum wage here. |
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Halo2-tankwhore Goomba Level: 9  Posts: 2/30 EXP: 2833 For next: 329 Since: 01-09-05 From: I'm being that kid... Since last post: 161 days Last activity: 161 days |
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| Sorry this post is kind of off-topic, but this is how I feel. As much as every person I know hates their teachers, it is a blatant outrage that the men and women that educate the future leaders of our world are paid as though they're convenient store clerks. | |||
Samur4iX Double hammer Banned. Level: 9 Posts: 14/28 EXP: 2523 For next: 639 Since: 01-16-05 Since last post: 287 days Last activity: 259 days |
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| I went to a catholic school (btw im not catholic) for 8 years, and you always knew they were underpaid (its kinda implied). Nevertheless, i believe they were way better teachers then the overpaid ones here in CA (dude, its obious they are overpaid when they have porshes, vipers, etc) Ironnically, under the system here, some of my favorite teachers are paid the least (Japanese, Orchestra, and English) | |||
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Kefka Indefinitely Unbanned Level: 81 Posts: 2580/3392 EXP: 4826208 For next: 166641 Since: 03-15-04 From: Pomona, CALIFORNIA BABY! Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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Originally posted by Samur4iX Um, not all of CA has wealth. If you happen to be going to a private institution (which I assume you are, because they offer Jap), yes, the teachers are paid a little more there. But in the public schools, the funding is diminishing, and therefore the salaries are becoming less on average. Btw, how the hell do you know exactly how much your teachers make?  |
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Kitten Yiffer Purple wand Furry moderator Vivent l'exp����¯�¿�½������©rience de signalisation d'amusement, ou bien ! Level: 135 Posts: 7409/11162 EXP: 28824106 For next: 510899 Since: 03-15-04 From: Sweden Since last post: 3 hours Last activity: 4 min. |
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In Sweden, they are definaitly underpaid. At least some of the good working ones, I can understand a few type of teachers having a lower salery than other but...  And honestly, there is a shortage of teachers in Sweden. Due it not being a attractive job... |
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Ran-chan Moldorm eek, when are they going to stop growing... Level: 143  Posts: 6938/12781 EXP: 35293588 For next: 538220 Since: 03-15-04 From: Nerima District, Tokyo - Japan Since last post: 12 hours Last activity: 12 hours |
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| "And honestly, there is a shortage of teachers in Sweden. Due it not being a attractive job..." It can be because they |
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