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1 user currently in Rom Hacking:  hukka |
| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - Rom Hacking - F-Zero X |
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22  Posts: 19/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| Oh, okay. No bother. Now that I know it's Mute City 3, this will work just fine. The only reason I suggested Mute City 2 is because that course has areas that have differring values for banking and left/right side widths. But according to the Mute City 1 doc that DavePhaneuf e-mailed me, the values are identical to what I've found in the ROM. No problem. Thanks for the info. It will prove useful. All that's needed is the data for the 12 DD courses, so I'll be eagerly awaiting it. __________ EDIT: When you provide the course data, Heian-794, give me the course descriptions in Katakana as they appear in the game. I've hacked the text system in the game, and all versions support the Japanese characters. Go ahead and post the characters in the normal reply box. The forum supports them. For example: If you were to use Red Canyon in the Queen Cup, you would say "ジャンプジャンプ" instead of "Jump Jump"... which is all the more confusing, because it's "Multi-Jump" in the English versions of the game. Regardless, just give me the Katakana and I'd appreciate it. __________ EDIT 2: In case you were curious, Heian-794, Mute City 3's description is "Jumps of Doom" in the English versions of the game, which is why I didn't recognize "Crank Crank". (edited by BGNG on 06-08-05 04:05 PM) (edited by BGNG on 06-08-05 04:12 PM) |
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Heian-794 Red Super Koopa Level: 44 Posts: 707/896 EXP: 611014 For next: 271 Since: 06-01-04 From: Kyoto, Japan Since last post: 21 days Last activity: 10 days |
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| EDIT 2: In case you were curious, Heian-794, Mute City 3's description is "Jumps of Doom" in the English versions of the game, which is why I didn't recognize "Crank Crank". Never would have guessed this! So the Japanese version focuses on the turns, whereas the English version assumes you'll try to cut them by jumping ^^; Crank Crank, as you can probably guess, is クランククランク in katakana. I'll get the DD courses next. Do you need road types too? Some of them seem to be defined by the background you choose for the course, whereas others have variety (dark asphalt-like surface vs. greyish surface in Mute City, for example). I still haven't mastered all of that and couldn't guess how it's coded. Nothing like Climax and its simple layouts! For now, here are the DD course names. DD-1 1 Silence 3 アウトサイドループ Outside Loop 2 Sand Ocean 3 シリンダーループ Cylinder Loop 3 Devil's Forest 4 ダイビング Diving 4 Port Town 3 ジグザグクランク Zigzag Crank (this course is fun!) 5 Devil's Forest 5 エックス "X" 6 Big Blue 3 ジャポン Japon (an outline of Japan in miniature) DD-2 1 Mute City 4 スリムハーフパイプ Slim Half-Pipe 2 Space Plant 2 ストレートジャンプ Straight Jump 3 Port Town 4 トラップロード Trap Road 4 Fire Field 2 １８０ローリング 180 (degree) Rolling 5 White Land 3 スター Star 6 Big Foot ビッグフット Big Foot (edited by Heian-794 on 06-08-05 11:12 PM) |
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 20/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| Sweetness. Thanks for the info. This will be useful immediately, even without the course data just yet. And thanks for the English translations, too... saves me the trouble of doing it. I'm considering taking the liberty to change a few of the descriptions when translated to English, however, for localization purposes. Namely, I'd like to do the following: Devil's Forest 4 - High Dive Devil's Forest 5 - ? Big Blue 3 - Japan Fire Field 2 - 180 Rollover White Land 3 - ? Big Foot - ? As you can see, I'm not sure what to make the description for some of those. Devil's Forest 5 is obviously in the shape of an "X," so making that the description doesn't do much. Same thing with White Land 3 and "Star." Different descriptions will need to be selected. Perhaps simply "Big X" and "Big Star," but I'd like something a little more interesting. Devil's Forest 4 has one nifty spot in it where you do indeed dive into a pipe, but "Diving" sounds kinda boring. "High Dive," however, is approperiate and somewhat clever, so I think it would be a good change. Big Blue 3, now that you mention it, DOES look like Japan. I never noticed that before. What is "Japon," anyways? I'm not familiar with that word/name. Regardless, I think that making the English translation "Japan" will be more effective. Big Foot simply repeats the name of the course, so it needs a new name. Big Hand in the Japanese version is "ビッグハンド", which of course is "Big Hand" when translated. But in the English versions of the game, it's "Deadly Curves," which is entirely different. So a similar name will be needed for Big Foot's similar structure. I'm thinking perhaps "Deadlier Curves" or "Painful Curves" or "Very Deadly Curves" or somethin'... All the other course descriptions look okay. (EDIT: On second thought, Fire Field 2 with "180 Rolling" sounds kinda odd... like it was translated from Japanese or something. So I've selected the phrase "180 Rollover" to make it more localized.) __________ I have videos of the DD tracks, so you won't need to give me ALL the data for the courses; just most of it. If the Expansion Kit notates things differently than the game does, make sure you give me the control points, in order, starting with the point that begins the finish strech... that is, NOT where the lap line is, but the one before that. The following is what I need for each course: General Stuff: Control Point Count - The number of control points that make the course Background Music Control Point Stuff: X Coordinate Y Coordinate Z Coordinate Banking Degrees Left-side Width Right-side Width Structures - Buildings, pyramids, etc. And that's it. With the videos that I have of the courses, I'll be able to do the rest. I can put in the track type (normal, cylinder, half-pipe, etc.), track color (dark, grey, rainbowy, etc.), Pit Area, Trap Fields, Dash Plates, decorations, billboards, venue, sky color, etc. So I've minimized what I absoltely must know to reconstruct the course in order to make less work for you. __________ Also, there are a few terms that haven't been well-documented. For example, one track type has high walls on both sides. I've been calling these "High-wall" segments, but does the Expansion Kit simply call them "Walled" segments? Then there's the blue slippery stuff. F-Zero GX calls this "Slip Zone," but I've never read what it is in F-Zero X. What does the Expansion Kit call it? (edited by BGNG on 06-09-05 06:49 AM) |
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RT-55J Ninji Level: 23  Posts: 90/240 EXP: 65287 For next: 2436 Since: 12-29-04 Since last post: 9 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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| To BGNG: I'd reccomend the following names for the course you can't decide on. Devil's Forest 5 - Giant X White Land 3 - Superstar (meh  )Big Foot - Killer Curves |
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Yoronosuku Bullet Bill YORO 4 GOD Level: 32 Posts: 143/502 EXP: 194954 For next: 11488 Since: 01-06-05 From: hailing from Oyamazaki, Kyoto Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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Big Foot should be the same. It is like the Big Hand level that was in regular F-Zero X (and both levels are super annoying!  ) Heian had a very accurate translation on those anyway. But you can certainly do whatever you feel is right! I was only suggesting ._. |
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Heian-794 Red Super Koopa Level: 44 Posts: 709/896 EXP: 611014 For next: 271 Since: 06-01-04 From: Kyoto, Japan Since last post: 21 days Last activity: 10 days |
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| Much more later, but for now... "Japon" is simply the French word for Japan. You could keep it in without any problems, I'd suppose. Incidentally, the course follows Japan's climate as well -- the northern parts, which represent Hokkaido on the maps, are full of slippery ice zones! The starting line looks like it's in Tokyo, and poor Okinawa is ignored altogether. (What would be cool would be to represent those islands with tiny bits of track that you have to make huge jumps to get to... now there's an idea for a course of mine!) | |||
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 21/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| Oh, okay. It'll probably be switched to "Japan" anyways. It doesn't make sense to have everything in English except this one word... 'course, I could also make it... uh... Is it approperiate to say "ニホン", or is that just something you don't do? And maybe I should follow the trend and make a course that's the outline of Illinois! I could call it Illinois - Land of Lincoln. Yessir, that's a classic right there. EVERYONE will love that course! (edited by BGNG on 07-03-05 10:39 PM) (edited by BGNG on 07-03-05 10:52 PM) (edited by BGNG on 07-04-05 12:01 AM) |
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Yoronosuku Bullet Bill YORO 4 GOD Level: 32 Posts: 147/502 EXP: 194954 For next: 11488 Since: 01-06-05 From: hailing from Oyamazaki, Kyoto Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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We do not use 3 Katakana to write "Nihon". . .we use the Kanji Nichi/Hi( 日 ) and hon( 本 ) to form Ni Hon. I think maybe there is another meaning to the Kanji but I am sort of horrible at remembering them  (edited by Yoronosuku on 06-11-05 05:57 AM) (edited by Yoronosuku on 06-11-05 05:57 AM) |
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 22/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| I am aware that the Kanji is the preferred form, but F-Zero X only supports Katakana characters, which is why I made that suggestion. Regardless, it'll probably end up as "Japan" anyways. (edited by BGNG on 06-11-05 07:17 AM) (edited by BGNG on 07-04-05 12:05 AM) (edited by BGNG on 07-04-05 12:06 AM) |
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Heian-794 Red Super Koopa Level: 44 Posts: 712/896 EXP: 611014 For next: 271 Since: 06-01-04 From: Kyoto, Japan Since last post: 21 days Last activity: 10 days |
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| Yoronosuku has it right; but why not turn the tables on the original designers (who used a foreign word for Japan) and call the track "Nippon"? Even though most Japanese people say "Nihon", everybody knows that the other pronunciation "Nippon" means Japan. (Edit: Just moved the F-Zero SNES stuff to the other F-Zero thread, as BGNG has requested. Sorry to clutter this one up with excess images.) (edited by Heian-794 on 06-11-05 07:41 AM) |
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 23/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| While I certainly don't have anything against the SNES F-Zero, or any other game for that matter, this is not the thread to post about it. Please keep this thread reserved for F-Zero X. | |||
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HyperLamer <||bass> and this was the soloution i thought of that was guarinteed to piss off the greatest amount of people Sesshomaru Tamaranian Level: 118 Posts: 4922/8210 EXP: 18171887 For next: 211027 Since: 03-15-04 From: Canada, w00t! LOL FAD Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Maybe you could just do some simple graphics hacks to add those specific Kanji? |
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Heian-794 Red Super Koopa Level: 44 Posts: 715/896 EXP: 611014 For next: 271 Since: 06-01-04 From: Kyoto, Japan Since last post: 21 days Last activity: 10 days |
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| I don't think he wants to put kanji into the game, HH; rather he needs to see what Japanese characters are being used so that he can figure out what parts of the hex data mean what. Presumably a hacked version would have track names in the language of the hacker. | |||
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 24/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| HyperHacker: The font is a fixed system of characters that cannot be altered without changing existing characters. Nintendo somehow locked the font set down to only those characters, and any other bytes yield undefined (but definable) results; all of which are undesirable. To do a graphics hack to include the Kanji for "日本" will require removing two existing characters from the font, and that's no good. __________ Heian-794 Truth to tell, I've already cracked the text stuff completely. The name and description strings use a rudimentary ASCII/Unicode combination character set to get the job done. Only a few ASCII characters are supported in the descriptions, and only "A," "D," "E" and "M" of the alphabet are in the descritions font (due to character names of Mighty Gazelle and Mr. EAD) Katakana characters, however, are stored as two-byte characters in the description strings. They're not Unicode, but almost. Their second-byte values are the same as Unicode, but the first byte for any Katakana is always the same: 0xA5, which funnily enough corresponds to the Yen symbol (" (edited by BGNG on 06-11-05 11:33 AM) (edited by BGNG on 06-11-05 11:37 AM) |
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HyperLamer <||bass> and this was the soloution i thought of that was guarinteed to piss off the greatest amount of people Sesshomaru Tamaranian Level: 118 Posts: 4932/8210 EXP: 18171887 For next: 211027 Since: 03-15-04 From: Canada, w00t! LOL FAD Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Odd... They went as far as removing unused letters, but used such a seemingly inefficient system? If they only support (most) Katakana and 4 Roman letters, I don't see why they would need 2 bytes.  (And if they did, you'd think they would use a special character to mark Roman letters, not Katakana.) |
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 25/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| You'd think so. And what's weirder is that in the non-Japanese versions of the game, all capital letters are present in the description font, but the only present lowercase letters are "c", "r" and "s" because of the names "Mr./Mrs. ARROW/Dr. CLASH/Dr. STEWART/Mr. EAD" and "JAMES McCLOUD." Interestingly enough, ALL the Katakana is still present in the non-Japanese versions of the game. The lowercase ASCII alphabet in the Japanese version is the first 26 Katakana characters, but three definitions were replaced with the above mentioned letters. Regardless of these circumstances, those three Katakana characters can still be used via the two-byte method. (edited by BGNG on 06-11-05 02:48 PM) |
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Yoronosuku Bullet Bill YORO 4 GOD Level: 32 Posts: 148/502 EXP: 194954 For next: 11488 Since: 01-06-05 From: hailing from Oyamazaki, Kyoto Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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| The Roman letters I think were used in Sector A and B. I do not know about the greek Y, however ._.; Has anyone ever heard the Mario Kart Rainbow Road song that was in F-Zero X's expansion? I have tried to work with the sound format to see if a port would ever be possible, but the only problem is I have no idea how any DD software works. I do not think that there is even a single ROM of such a thing . . . | |||
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 26/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| The α, β and γ characters are actually Greek, not Roman, and they are part of the name font, which is completely different from the description/character name font. The music uses what I believe to be the AIFF IMA implementation of ADPCM, but I've not had time to test that hypothesis. One thing is certain, however: there's not enough room in the ROM to add another music, nor can the existing musics become stereo. If it's possible to expand the ROM to 32MB, it may very well be possible to put in the Expansion Kit musics. I have high-res recordings of them that I would be able to implement if I were able to do so. __________ EDIT: Come to think of it, doing things that way will let us use any audio we want. There'd be no reason we couldn't stick in some F-Zero GX tunes, a favorite Weird Al track, etc... That may be worth lookin' into. (edited by BGNG on 06-11-05 03:21 PM) (edited by BGNG on 06-11-05 03:21 PM) |
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Yoronosuku Bullet Bill YORO 4 GOD Level: 32 Posts: 149/502 EXP: 194954 For next: 11488 Since: 01-06-05 From: hailing from Oyamazaki, Kyoto Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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| F-Zero GX uses a format by Sega Dreamcast! My brother taught me that! I think it might be even easier to figure out how that is played since there may be a player for that sort of file . . .Any way, this would mean that my theory that it is a similar format as Mario Kart 64 might be incorrect. Taro Bando did work on both however, I think that is why he used that music (and because Shigeru Miyamoto owns EAD, company and character they used that MK level too!) | |||
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BGNG Snifit Level: 22 Posts: 27/276 EXP: 56579 For next: 1771 Since: 06-03-05 Since last post: 8 days Last activity: 3 hours |
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| ADPCM is just a simple 4-to-1 compression algorithm that turns 16-bit audio into 4-bit audio. It's super-fast because it doesn't need any floating-point arithmetic to use a codec. Mario Kart 64 uses a MIDI-like interface to send musical note events to the sound hardware, but F-Zero X has all the audio built-in to the data, and is thusly different in format. That was kinda cryptic. Let me know if I need to reiterate. |
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