Posted by Yoshi Master

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See, I'm not trying to gloat like you are. I'm not saying," oh! yoshi is the best!" I'm just saying he was never bad. Lots of people think he's really bad. I mean, very few people are good with him. I'm not good with mewtwo, I don't think he's bad tho. And besides, I don't only fight cpus, unlike you I seem to have friends. I don't need to go to a tournament. I play for fun, not competition.

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Oh, this is lovely! You're saying I don't have friends, just because I like competition. I haven't had someone like you in a long time.

Yoshi's a bad character. Sure, you can win with him, but it'd be infinitely easier to win with a better character. Yes, some people are going to be awesome with him. Even my Samus would get utterly annihilated by Taj's Mewtwo. But just because people like Taj and Fumi exist, doesn't mean Mewtwo and Yoshi are tournament-capable. It means Taj and Fumi are awesome. I play a lot with Mewtwo, but unfortunately, I am not Taj. In the same way, Yoshi Master, just because you are better than your friends, doesn't mean you're good with Yoshi, as you can only ever be as good as your competition allows. Thus, you are not Fumi, and neither is Joshua. So... Unfortunately, you're wrong.

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Posted by AlexAR

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Yoshi's a bad character? There is no such thing as a bad character, only bad players. I have won numerous tournaments while using a wide variety of characters, including Yoshi. People rag on Yoshi because he doesn't have a proper Up B jump save move. But Yoshi is very strong relative to his speed and can take hits very well.

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Sorry, but no. I'm not sure quite how you came to the belief that all characters are inherently equal, and that it is decided entirely by skill, but it's unfounded. Two different things can never be balanced. Even if it was somehow possible, it would not be possible for it to be designed by a human. 25 things, which are all different in many ways, have things no one else can do... It's completely impossible. So yes, by physics alone, the game must be unbalanced at some level, and there must be bad characters.

You may win tournaments, but that still doesn't prove anything, because if those are local tournaments, which is likely, competition is going to be low, and if you're better than your competition to any significant degree, then you can win even if you use... Well... Yoshi. That doesn't make the character good, it makes the people bad. It creates an illusion that the character is good, but this is unfounded. The sad truth is that it's not just that they're harder to get good with. The very best that anyone can get with Yoshi is just not as good as the very best that anyone can get with Jigglypuff, let alone Fox. However, even if none of this were true, my initial post on the matter was not really talking about tiers. It was stating that computers suck at the game, and that beating them three of them doesn't prove anything at all - I have one-upped his feat with Mewtwo, but I still think Mewtwo's worse than Yoshi... Because he is. He's not a lot worse - they're BOTH at the bottom tier, after all - but he is. And compare either one to Captain Falcon and the difference is just obvious.

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A low tier character in a master's hands CAN be a force to be reckoned with. But on the other hand, even Taj, the best Mewtwo player in the world, still recognizes that in important matches, playing as Mewtwo is insane. He mains Marth and Fox.

The tier list perfectly accurate, and it's not like every Fox (best character) will always beat every Mewtwo (worst character). Even in major tournaments, you see people doing well even with Ganondorf, the bottom of the middle tier... But to say it doesn't matter at all is crazy talk.

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^{[citation needed]}

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