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GreyMaria
Posted on 09-07-08 04:57 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90036

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Once again you prove you have no idea what you're talking about and also have no desire to learn.

I give up.

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NightKev
Posted on 09-07-08 05:12 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90039


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Posted by Grey Mario
Once again you prove you have no idea what you're talking about and also have no desire to learn.

I give up.
Like I said, he is a troll. I would advise everyone to ignore his posts ("don't feed the trolls").

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boingboingsplat
Posted on 09-07-08 05:23 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90040


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Posted by Trax
Where does money come from, then? Black Lord said the opposite a few posts ago. And even if we assume they use the clients' money (which is probably not true), they are still making money with fantom money, which should be considered illegal...

What is wrong with you.
1) The money comes from the US Treasury. Duh.
2) Black Lord doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
3) The bank uses the clients' money for transactions.
4) There is no "phantom" money. Its all real money. I have no idea where you got this idea.

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Trax
Posted on 09-07-08 09:36 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90048


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Last view: 2883 days 		This is getting even stranger. So, the money comes from US Treasury. It is created there when you contract a loan and the bank is allowed to add a percentage on it in interests, in exchange of nothing. But, at the same time, the bank uses the clients' money for transactions. What kind of transaction? If it's transactions that involve only money, the allegation still stands: banks are allowed to buy money. And if a bank can lend the same amount of money more than once, they really are lending "fantom" money...

NightKev, if you don't like this thread, don't post in it...

boingboingsplat
Posted on 09-07-08 02:42 PM Link | Quote | ID: 90054


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Posted by Trax
And if a bank can lend the same amount of money more than once, they really are lending "fantom" money...

No, then they lend some of the rest of their money.
If there was not enough money for you to take out your, then you wouldn't be able to take it out. (This will never actually happen in real life.)

By the way, its "phantom" not "fantom."

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Trax
Posted on 09-11-08 03:27 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90304


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Last view: 2883 days 		Let's assume they take from their "big pile of money" and lend a sum to you. All banks in the world do this, and expect their clients to repay the loan, plus some interests. The interests come from nowhere, they are added to the load arbitrarily. So how do you expect to repay it?

Black Lord
Posted on 09-11-08 01:09 PM Link | Quote | ID: 90323


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Posted by boingboingsplat

2) Black Lord doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.


First, come tell my economics professor he doesn't know what he is talking about. Also, check out the link, I tried to pick one you guys would understand a bit more, I'll look for others.

How Banks Create Money



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KP9000
Posted on 09-12-08 01:01 AM (rev. 2 of 09-12-08 01:03 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 90346


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Posted by Black Lord
How Banks Create Money
I call bullshit on that article. First of all, banks have never "created" money at all. It just doesn't fucking happen. If a loan is made for $90k out of a deposit of $100k by a customer, the bank does not have $90k. They have $10k until the borrower paid the money back. In this case the money comes from the borrower, plus some interest. That interest is what makes money for the bank.

In the article, it shows that the initial deposit of the customer is $100k. They went on to note that a series of other loans can be made off this deposit, this case totaling (after interest for the depositing customer) $238,900. Now, here's the funny thing, the money wasn't created. It still has to come from somewhere. In this case, the borrower's pockets. It is paid back with existing money in circulation. So how do they make money? They don't create it, that's for damn sure. They charge borrowers interest, and rates are based on the borrower's credit, and how well the banker is feeling that day.

So there you have it. The bank does not fucking create any money.

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NightKev
Posted on 09-12-08 01:08 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90349


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Posted by Trax
Let's assume they take from their "big pile of money" and lend a sum to you. All banks in the world do this, and expect their clients to repay the loan, plus some interests. The interests come from nowhere, they are added to the load arbitrarily. So how do you expect to repay it?
Maybe if you HAVE A JOB and thus have INCOME. Fucking duh.
If you don't have a job and are not currently making any money, I seriously doubt any bank would give you a loan (since you obviously have no way of paying it back).

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Black Lord
Posted on 09-12-08 01:22 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90356


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Posted by KP9000
Posted by Black Lord
How Banks Create Money
I call bullshit on that article. First of all, banks have never "created" money at all. It just doesn't fucking happen. If a loan is made for $90k out of a deposit of $100k by a customer, the bank does not have $90k. They have $10k until the borrower paid the money back. In this case the money comes from the borrower, plus some interest. That interest is what makes money for the bank.

In the article, it shows that the initial deposit of the customer is $100k. They went on to note that a series of other loans can be made off this deposit, this case totaling (after interest for the depositing customer) $238,900. Now, here's the funny thing, the money wasn't created. It still has to come from somewhere. In this case, the borrower's pockets. It is paid back with existing money in circulation. So how do they make money? They don't create it, that's for damn sure. They charge borrowers interest, and rates are based on the borrower's credit, and how well the banker is feeling that day.

So there you have it. The bank does not fucking create any money.


Seriously... banks do not have to have all the money to back a loan... just a small portion of it (around 10% if I recall correctly).... So where does the other 90% or so of the loan come from?

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KP9000
Posted on 09-12-08 01:25 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90357


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The bank could not do that if the $100k from that customer was the entire amount the bank had. They loan more money from the pool of money that they have, from other customer's deposits.

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IIIMarckus
Posted on 09-12-08 03:50 AM Link | Quote | ID: 90371


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Posted by KP9000
Posted by Black Lord
How Banks Create Money
I call bullshit on that article. First of all, banks have never "created" money at all. It just doesn't fucking happen. If a loan is made for $90k out of a deposit of $100k by a customer, the bank does not have $90k. They have $10k until the borrower paid the money back. In this case the money comes from the borrower, plus some interest. That interest is what makes money for the bank.

In the article, it shows that the initial deposit of the customer is $100k. They went on to note that a series of other loans can be made off this deposit, this case totaling (after interest for the depositing customer) $238,900. Now, here's the funny thing, the money wasn't created. It still has to come from somewhere. In this case, the borrower's pockets. It is paid back with existing money in circulation. So how do they make money? They don't create it, that's for damn sure. They charge borrowers interest, and rates are based on the borrower's credit, and how well the banker is feeling that day.

So there you have it. The bank does not fucking create any money.
Fractional-reserve banking is money creation. Ask any economist.

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Black Lord
Posted on 09-27-08 04:44 PM Link | Quote | ID: 91167


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Fractional-Reserve Banking Video - 45 minutes long.

Seriously, people need to get educated about this if you live in the US. Especially with all the issues, you need to understand how this stuff is working. Banks do create money... if you don't think so, you are horribly misinformed. I hated to drag this back up, but with the current problems, people need to know how the stuff works. If people don't understand... and start panicking with the current banking issues... we could be in a world of hurt (The Greater) Depression).

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blackhole89
Posted on 09-27-08 08:41 PM Link | Quote | ID: 91180


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Posted by Black Lord
(The Greater) Depression).

Depressions are great indeed. Start growing your own crops and smile gleefully while watching your capitalist neighbours take the 9mm aspirin.



What are the opinions on the latest "crisis" around here, anyway?

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Trax
Posted on 09-27-08 11:34 PM Link | Quote | ID: 91189


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Last view: 2883 days 		I didn't dig it a lot, but I have a feeling, from past experience and research, that this could be a key-point event in the financial world. Just like the events that preceded the crash of 1929, those events look like they were orchestrated. Some will be "sacrificed" in the process (notice the quotes because bank top brass don't really "sacrifice" something even if their bank explodes), but at the end, some special interest groups will gain something from it. That's for sure...

We have an example of pure money creation, here. The Federal Reserve (which is not Federal nor a Reserve) "injected" no less than 100 millions $ in the economy to "recuperate" it because of all the drops on the speculation markets. Berk...

Speculation markets are a nasty plague...

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