What are your oppinions on various langauges?

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Main - Computing - What are your oppinions on various langauges?

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Squash Monster

Posted on 03-02-07 09:07 AM

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I started typing all of this up as part of my response to the first language thread, and realized it might be a better idea to have a dedicated thread. I'm sure a lot of us have used a lot of languages, what do you all think of them?

My opinions:
TI-BASIC - a very solid version of BASIC overall. Some might knock it, but if you know what you're doing and you have the 83+ SE (the 83+ standard is too damn slow) you can make some very nice things with it. And you can't get away with using a better language during your calculus class.
iC - buggy shit, but if you're determined you can make some neat stuff with it. I made a very nifty port of my game Treasure for the XBC using iC, so I can't knock the language too much. There are major problems with the language though, especially the compiler not catching errors that should be caught compile-time.
Liberty Basic - it's every cheap Windows version of BASIC that has ever been devised. You can do better.
Visual Basic 6 - is junk. Note that it's not shit, it's just junk. Like the stuff you find at a junk-yard, you can find uses for it, and sometimes it's the best place to go to get what you need. If you already know the language or know BASIC enough to wing it, and you need to write a quick simple application, it is easily the language of choice.
VB.net - is not junk, because it is shit.
Game Maker - worse than BASIC. Lack of proper support for functions is a terrible thing, and you should not put up with it. The features the language comes packaged with are not worth it.
Java - easily the best programming language I have ever used. My list of complaints goes something like this: 1) static imports do not work unless you put things in packages. 2) swing sucks. Swing sucks hard. (That's the entire list)
C++ - ugly Java that's harder to debug. No, it's not faster unless you're compiling with a chip-specific compiler, and I doubt you are. No, the extra control of pointers is not useful. Either Java or C will kick its ass at just about any task.
C - a very solid language. If you can make due with using structs instead of objects, you should probably consider using it. Java is still far more elegant and expressive, but for smaller projects C is probably a better choice. If there's any change you'll have more than a few errors on your first run you probably should just switch to Java before you even get started, though.
IA32 assembly is awesome. If you're good, want speed, and don't care at all about cross-platform compatibility, then just bite the bullet and give it a shot. The fact that you can include assembly source files into C code but C++ usually gets itself confused is why C is ranked so much higher than C++. Also, my biggest complaint is the fact that movl (%eax), (%ebx) is not a valid command - it bugs the hell out of me, and I want an assembler that breaks it into two commands instead of hassling me to do it myself.
JavaScript - a ridiculously expressive language. Seriously. The things you can do with JavaScript objects are hideous, terrifying, and pretty much limitless. It's a very good thing JavaScript is confined to your browser, because if you could do actual heavy-lifting with this language things would get utterly insane. That said, don't even bother unless you already are a good programmer and know HTML and CSS, because it's pretty pointless if you're missing any of those three skills.

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MathOnNapkins

Posted on 03-02-07 01:08 PM

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No, the extra control of pointers is not useful

......... I'm just can't believe you would say this. Not useful? *foams at mouth and dies*

In any case, I'd say I have just as many errors when writing java programs as with C or C++ programs.

movl (%eax), (%ebx) not working? Can't you write a macro?

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Kernal

Posted on 03-02-07 02:52 PM

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Commodore Basic - Too slow to do anything useful, but still fun to play around in sometimes. My C64 broke in 2005 though, so I have to fire up the emulator.
Qbasic - Sheer misery. I hate the AUTO-FORMAT FEATURE THAT CAN'T BE TURNED OFF THAT PUTS YOUR CODE IN ALL UPPERCASE. I tried this once and didn't like it, deciding that I would do my DOS/Windows programming in C instead.
C - Probably my favourite language. Fast, not too complex, and none of that funky OOP garbage. Plus it runs on just about any computer imaginable.
C++ - Like C, only weirder. I don't mind C++ but I prefer C. I don't like OOP in most cases although it does have its uses.
Java - The prime advantage of this is that one Java program can be run on Windows, Linux, Mac OSX, etc. without recompiling for each OS. The disadvantage is the language itself: ugh. EVERYTHING must be in a class, even main, and each class needs its own file. I prefer dealing with one larger file than 30 small ones for programs that aren't that big. GUI programming is particularly grotesgue. And the verbiage! I love the short, simple names in C: printf, char, fopen, etc. I hate typing out all 31 characters of StringIndexOutOfBoundsException.
PHP - Sheer awesomeness except for all its security problems.
MYSQL - Syntax is too wordy and COBOL-esque for my tastes, being used to all the symbols in C, but what would we do without it? A very powerful database management tool.
HTML - Nice 1990's-style simplicity. I hate these attempts to replace most of HTML with CSS.
XHTML - What's all the fuss about? It's just like HTML only you need a / after your br tags.
Haskell - Kinda weird, but I'm actually understanding recursion now, not that I like it much.
Pascal - Ugh. Blehh. Vomit. "BEGIN" and "END"? Where are my curly brackets?

Katelyn

Posted on 03-02-07 03:15 PM

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Apple II BASIC - My first programming language, used in elementary school.
Qbasic - I hate SHOUTING programs!
C - One of my favourite languages to program in.
C++ - Basically C with OOP.
Visual Basic - I hated it because it's Microsoft.
Delphi - Not bad, but not too good either. Had to use this in computer class at school.
PHP - Awesome! Too bad it has some security problems.

OoBurns

Posted on 03-02-07 09:57 PM

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Posted by Squash Monster
TI-BASIC - a very solid version of BASIC overall. Some might knock it, but if you know what you're doing and you have the 83+ SE (the 83+ standard is too damn slow) you can make some very nice things with it. And you can't get away with using a better language during your calculus class.

That's actually what gave me the idea that I might like computer programming. I started messing around with it one time when I was bored. I actually still play around with it when I'm bored during math or physics, and I've been able to make some pretty cool things with it. I can't claim to have any decent experience with any of the other languages yet.

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HydraPheetz

Posted on 03-02-07 10:47 PM

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Python - Really useful and easy-to-learn language.
Perl - Regular expressions GALORE, although you can do some really powerful things with it.
PHP - It simplifies development of web apps.
C - I'm still learning it. However, it's still used widely, and I'm really interested in actually learning.
C++ - C with objects.

And now for some other... languages that I have messed with before...

Lisp - (long(and(annoying(string(of(parenthesis))))))
Befunge - Fun little time-killer
Brainfuck - [+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++>><+<<].

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Kernal

Posted on 03-02-07 11:09 PM

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Why is the TI calculator language called Basic? As far as I know it isn't any relation to the various Basic languages by Microsoft and has many significant syntactical differences (such as assignment statements being 5 -> X instead of X = 5).

DarkSlaya

Posted on 03-02-07 11:50 PM

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Posted by Nyletak
PHP - Awesome! Too bad it has some security problems.

If people didn't suck at security in the first place.

Squash Monster

Posted on 03-03-07 09:29 AM

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Posted by MathOnNapkins
No, the extra control of pointers is not useful

......... I'm just can't believe you would say this. Not useful? *foams at mouth and dies*

In any case, I'd say I have just as many errors when writing java programs as with C or C++ programs.

movl (%eax), (%ebx) not working? Can't you write a macro?

Yeah, I can. I'm gonna get around to it at some point, but I did mean for it to be a silly complaint. I actually like assembly quite a bit.

The extra control of pointers bit is partially exaggeration, but I really do find it mostly useless in C++. If you're making object-oriented type stuffs you're going to end up using pointers the same way as Java defaults you to, and if you're not making object-oriented stuff you really aught to be using C. As I said, I really think it's better to just use Java or plain old C instead.

Posted by Kernal
Why is the TI calculator language called Basic? As far as I know it isn't any relation to the various Basic languages by Microsoft and has many significant syntactical differences (such as assignment statements being 5 -> X instead of X = 5).

It's a procedural programming language with no curly braces and statements like Then and End, what more do you need?

Posted by HydraPheetz
Brainfuck - [+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++>><+<<].

An infinite loop that just keeps adding one to the same spot? You can do so much better!
+>+<[[->>+>+<<<]>[->>>+>+<<<<]>>[-<<<+>>>]>>[-<<<<+>>>>]<[-<<+>>]<<<]
(I hope I got that right, it's not like I'm gonna go find a BF interpreter just to check)

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Xkeeper

Posted on 03-03-07 11:59 AM

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Posted by Nyletak
PHP - Awesome! Too bad it has some security problems.

It does?

Most security problems are the fault of the coder...

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Kernal

Posted on 03-03-07 02:51 PM

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Posted by Squash Monster
It's a procedural programming language with no curly braces and statements like Then and End, what more do you need?

There are other such languages. Isn't Pascal like that?

blackhole89

Posted on 03-03-07 03:08 PM

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C - like a lot. Still pretty much my favourite language.
C++ - While I quite like it, it does have some obvious design flaws.
Objective-C - C++' forgotten evil twin brother. Weird in any sense that word can convey.
x86 assembly - Intel syntax: like, AT&T syntax: dislike. Though it might be for large parts because I got used to the former too much. xD
PHP - a chimera of a language. While it's certainly practical for some purposes, the language design is a horrible mess.
Java - Dislike. The VMs are memory whores, fairly slow (at least under Windows) and the whole language design doesn't appeal to me. Then, I am biased because I have an antipathy against Sun Microsystems ever since Solaris and CDE.
Brainfuck - lolz
Lua - Stinks of BASIC.
Pascal, Object Pascal and everything related - dislike. Bulky languages, too much focus on noob friendliness and not nearly as powerful as I'd like to see a language.
Visual Basic - if you like Excel, then perhaps... *cough*
Scheme - Oddball. Though, in an alternate world, with other processor designs and stuff... it probably could implement certain algorithms much more effectively than today's languages can.
ASP - Basic for LEET WEB DESIGNERZ LOLOL
JavaScript - Miserably implemented, buggy, slow... dfgdsfh
65c816 assembly - Nothing too good or bad that can be said about it.
Atmel AVR assembly - Interesting, though the abundance of registers (32 of them on the platforms I worked with) often requires/encourages vastly different approaches at implementing things from what you do on systems with a small count of working regs.
eAthena scripting - SDGH"!$!"$()/!=#?

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