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HyperHacker

Star Mario
Finally being paid to code in VB! If only I still enjoyed that. <_<
Wii #7182 6487 4198 1828


 





Since: 11-18-05
From: Canada, w00t!
My computer's specs, if anyone gives a damn.
STOP TRUNCATING THIS >8^(

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6328 days
Posted on 01-29-06 03:51 PM Link | Quote
It used to be that if Explorer (the Windows shell) was taking up too much memory, or I just didn't want it running (I sometimes close it to see how various programs of mine react), I could just fire up Process Explorer (a more powerful task manager) and close it. I just did this, though, and it messed up quite a bit:

  • Windows show on the taskbar that shouldn't. This may be because their owner was the desktop before Explorer closed, but it didn't do this before.
  • Some items are missing from the system tray.
  • My sound system is messed up. The volume control on the keyboard (even Mute) does nothing, and when I try to open the volume control, it says I have no sound card. This is very interesting because there is a song playing in Winamp RIGHT NOW. This happened once before too, and I had to reboot, which I'll have to do again now.


I of course want to know any way to fix this, but also, I wouldn't mind hearing of alternate shells if anyone has any suggestions. (I will Google, but may as well ask too.) The sort of shell I want would...
  • Support WinXP, even better if it takes advantage of XP-only features
  • Use less resources (CPU/memory) than Explorer
  • Retain most of the useful features, like Quick Launch and the ability to put your taskbar on the right side of the screen
  • Not be full of bugs
  • Be compatible with programs that manipulate the desktop window (API functions GetShellWindow(), GetDC() applied to this window, and PaintDesktop() need to work)
  • Support the Win+R, Win+D and Win+M shortcuts that I use the crap out of


Additionally, things that would be nice but aren't important are...
  • Ability to not have a clock on the taskbar
  • Support for making the taskbar and Start menu translucent (Explorer's wig out when you do this)
  • A 'quick search' box like lololol's search box (I think Mac's shell has this) where you can search for files in the current folder, and they get selected as the're found
  • Customizeable shortcut keys
  • Not costing money
  • Work on Win98, or have a Win98 version without any XP-only features (my brother's computer is sloooooow, a nice replacement shell would probably do wonders)
  • Ability to close the shell without having to terminate the process (I know it should have the same effect, but it's so hacky)
  • Plugins
  • Ability to run without closing Explorer (or able to close Explorer itself) or requiring admin access, so I can use it at school (from a memory stick); doesn't matter if it changes settings, as they use Deep Freeze. I could write my own close-Explorer-and-run-something-else app if I need to, but it has to work in a limited account as I don't feel like getting in a lot of shit just to use an alternate shell.


Thanks in advance. Unless you just come in here and act like an ass, then screw you.
FreeDOS +

Giant Red Koopa
Legion: freedos = fritos








Since: 11-17-05
From: Seattle

Last post: 6327 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-29-06 04:07 PM Link | Quote
So the symptoms you described sounds like all the versions of Explorer from 95 to XP anyway ;P

I can recommend:
* Blackbox (for Windows of course, bb4win.org)
* ROS Explorer
* A better OS

(edited by FreeDOS on 01-29-06 03:08 PM)
Ailure

Mr. Shine
I just want peace...








Since: 11-17-05
From: Sweden

Last post: 6327 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-29-06 05:31 PM Link | Quote
Just you know, but if explorer uses alot memory (over 20 MB), then I might advise you to check for viruses. In Safe-mode. I had a virus once that created thread in other processes, and causing big memory leaks. Letting the anti-virus run in safe-mode fixed it... I have no idea where the virus came from but i'm suspecting my IE using sister. xD Oh well, this was for a year ago now.
Xkeeper
Took the board down in a blaze of glory, only to reveal how truly moronical ||bass is.


 





Since: 11-17-05
From: Henderson, Nevada

Last post: 6327 days
Last view: 6327 days
Skype
Posted on 01-29-06 05:38 PM Link | Quote
I've never had Explorer taking up over 15 MB, ever, even when I have a taskbar full of items and about 15 explorer windows open...

And those system tray problems aren't suprising, as most things disappear from the system tray when it disappears.

The mute/etc buttons are probably hooked into Explorer (as it's always open, ususally, anyway) so that's to be expected.
||bass
Administrator








Since: 11-17-05
From: Salem, Connecticut

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-29-06 11:14 PM Link | Quote
I can't belive people here arent SCREAMING "Litestep".
Litestep fits everything you just asked for.
HyperHacker

Star Mario
Finally being paid to code in VB! If only I still enjoyed that. <_<
Wii #7182 6487 4198 1828


 





Since: 11-18-05
From: Canada, w00t!
My computer's specs, if anyone gives a damn.
STOP TRUNCATING THIS >8^(

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6328 days
Posted on 01-31-06 03:24 AM Link | Quote
That was actually the first thing that came to mind, but when I came across their web page, it was one of those lame sites that you have to register to even view.

I'll check out those others (interestingly none of them came up in my search ). A virus seems unlikely, especially with AVG running, but individual Explorer processes can take up anywhere from 10-50MB. It may have to do with having folders open with a lot of images/videos in them.
||bass
Administrator








Since: 11-17-05
From: Salem, Connecticut

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-31-06 10:59 AM Link | Quote
Try this site: http://www.beyondconvention.net/ohussain/
FreeDOS +

Giant Red Koopa
Legion: freedos = fritos








Since: 11-17-05
From: Seattle

Last post: 6327 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-31-06 01:59 PM Link | Quote
Well Litestep seems nice, but when I tried it, it wasn't so great for the real deal.

A virus does seem unlikely to me too, the bugs of Explorer you described happen to me all the time in Windows.
||bass
Administrator








Since: 11-17-05
From: Salem, Connecticut

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-31-06 03:41 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by FreeDOS
Well Litestep seems nice, but when I tried it, it wasn't so great for the real deal.

A virus does seem unlikely to me too, the bugs of Explorer you described happen to me all the time in Windows.
Did you try multiple themes & modules or just the defaults?

(edited by ||bass on 01-31-06 05:59 PM)
FreeDOS +

Giant Red Koopa
Legion: freedos = fritos








Since: 11-17-05
From: Seattle

Last post: 6327 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-31-06 04:13 PM Link | Quote
It was more of general bugginess... none of the other pre-made themes attracted me either. Making my own theme wasn't so easy either.. I'd rather make a style for KDE than litestep
||bass
Administrator








Since: 11-17-05
From: Salem, Connecticut

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-31-06 07:00 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by FreeDOS
It was more of general bugginess... none of the other pre-made themes attracted me either. Making my own theme wasn't so easy either.. I'd rather make a style for KDE than litestep
I'd be interested to hear what version/module/theme combinations you used. I've never tended to have any problems with it.

(edited by ||bass on 02-01-06 03:56 PM)
HyperHacker

Star Mario
Finally being paid to code in VB! If only I still enjoyed that. <_<
Wii #7182 6487 4198 1828


 





Since: 11-18-05
From: Canada, w00t!
My computer's specs, if anyone gives a damn.
STOP TRUNCATING THIS >8^(

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6328 days
Posted on 01-31-06 10:21 PM Link | Quote
Well, I'm using Litestep now, and my opinion is basically "huh?". I don't see what's so special. Just a Linux-style taskbar (which can't be moved from the bottom ) and one small menu with my Quick Launch and Start Menu folders, a lot of text and INI files, and basic system commands in it. The taskbar feels cluttered (I don't need a Winamp control bar or a clock, those quick launch icons are HUGE, and I don't even know what that thing next to the Start menu is supposed to do), and it still uses Explorer for file browsing anyway! Also it seems to handle screen sizing differently; in Explorer, the border around windows would go out of the screen area when they're maximized, in this it doesn't, which looks quite ugly. I'm glad to see it does support Win+R and Win+M (though Win+M minimizes everything, crashing some programs) though. Not to mention the desktop is ugly (that font just sucks and I can't actually select the icons) and it isn't compatible with desktop-manipulating programs (if this is even possible). Finally these menus are a joke, jumping around here and there and closing if you don't move the mouse over them every 10th of a second.

It is certainly lightweight, which is nice; I might consider using it on my brother's computer as Win98 Explorer tends to bog it down (it's old ). But what good would that do if it uses Explorer for file browsing anyway?
FreeDOS +

Giant Red Koopa
Legion: freedos = fritos








Since: 11-17-05
From: Seattle

Last post: 6327 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 01-31-06 10:29 PM Link | Quote
||bass: Windows 2000, some version back in 2003, default theme and none of the pre-made themes looked good either.

HH: It's funny how you say "Linux-style taskbar" which doesn't even make sense. Also consider buying 98lite for the Win98 computer... it works wonders.
HyperHacker

Star Mario
Finally being paid to code in VB! If only I still enjoyed that. <_<
Wii #7182 6487 4198 1828


 





Since: 11-18-05
From: Canada, w00t!
My computer's specs, if anyone gives a damn.
STOP TRUNCATING THIS >8^(

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6328 days
Posted on 01-31-06 10:47 PM Link | Quote
I mean the style used in every Linux I've ever used and every Linux screenshot I've ever seen.

Anyway, I'm using BlackBox now. It's interesting but not a lot better. My desktop is now a single icon with no name. Clicking it I find that again, the authors have decided that Explorer should be used for file browsing... maybe I'm just plain wrong but I've always considered the file browser to be part - THE part - of the shell.

The taskbar: it's certainly nicer than Litestep's but still not much. It's not so much a bar anymore as something that sits at the bottom or top - again, not the side - of the screen with your windows on it. The windows go under it, instead of the space being reserved, which IMO just sucks as I can no longer see what's there when the windows are maximized. The buttons are fairly buggy and tend to be drawn at the wrong width. There is NO Start menu; I have to minimize all the active windows and right-click the desktop instead. And I still can't get rid of the clock.

Really, about the only thing this has going for it is it looks pretty. I suppose there's probably plugins to improve a lot of these issues. I'd appreciate knowing if there are. I see a lot of them listed on the site... would it kill them to add even a small description of what they do?

[edit] Alright, so now I'm using ROS Explorer. It's not too bad, does what it should, though programs don't seem to be able to reserve screen space. (Though desktop window interaction does work. ) I'm rather confused by the file browser though. If I go to My Computer I get this really ugly browser with no window title. However if I open a shortcut to a folder, I get something that looks exactly like XP's Explorer, but no instance of it appears (Process Explorer shows its window as belonging to ROS Explorer). Biggest problem I'm seeing is lack of Win+R/M/D support.

So overall, it's alright, but quite ugly.

[edit 2] Any help getting Winamp's main window back would be appreciated as well.

(edited by Hyper LOL on 01-31-06 10:00 PM)
(edited by Hyper LOL on 01-31-06 10:09 PM)
||bass
Administrator








Since: 11-17-05
From: Salem, Connecticut

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 02-01-06 05:07 PM Link | Quote
You seem to be making alot of presumptions about Litestep, most of which seem to stem from the fact that you don't appear to know how to configure it.

Litestep is NOT explorer.exe, it's not going to baby you, if you don't configure it, you won't be happy.

Here are a few litestep desktops:
Click each to enlarge:





Don't talk down about a peice of great software just because you don't know how to use it.

(edited by ||bass on 02-02-06 06:11 PM)
HyperHacker

Star Mario
Finally being paid to code in VB! If only I still enjoyed that. <_<
Wii #7182 6487 4198 1828


 





Since: 11-18-05
From: Canada, w00t!
My computer's specs, if anyone gives a damn.
STOP TRUNCATING THIS >8^(

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6328 days
Posted on 02-02-06 04:16 PM Link | Quote
Huh, I could have sworn I said I couldn't find any way to configure it. I didn't mean to sound overly negative. I want to have it looking like those images (and BTW, the links are broken), but how? I'm not saying it sucks because I don't know how to set it up; I'm saying my experience with it sucks because I don't know how to set it up. (Hell, I'd still use it now if it used its own file browser and the desktop icons worked right. )

I got Winamp's head back BTW. Just had to muck with the INI a bit.

[edit] And apparently I fail at grammar.

(edited by Hyper LOL on 02-02-06 03:17 PM)
||bass
Administrator








Since: 11-17-05
From: Salem, Connecticut

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6327 days
Posted on 02-02-06 07:13 PM Link | Quote
This weekend, I'll post information on how to make litestep look like those 4 screenshots I posted.

Also: Links to enlarge the images fixed.
HyperHacker

Star Mario
Finally being paid to code in VB! If only I still enjoyed that. <_<
Wii #7182 6487 4198 1828


 





Since: 11-18-05
From: Canada, w00t!
My computer's specs, if anyone gives a damn.
STOP TRUNCATING THIS >8^(

Last post: 6328 days
Last view: 6328 days
Posted on 02-10-06 06:46 PM Link | Quote
So... it's next weekend.
max

Blipper

i'm a pixie !!!


 





Since: 11-17-05

Last post: 6588 days
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Posted on 02-10-06 07:37 PM Link | Quote
you can get premade litestep themes over at wincustomize
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