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| Acmlm's Board - I3 Archive - World Affairs/Debate - Do you believe that science goes against religion? |
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Deleted User Banned                 Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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Originally posted by Gavin So science argues against every component of religion? And why shouldn't scientists be allowed to talk about religion? It seems that religious speakers are permitted to speak about science as much as they want, why should scientists be so mute? |
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Clockworkz Birdon       Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| I'm kinda surprised that you took that seriously. He's mocking those people. Just look at his grammar and spelling. The rest of his posts are about 10x as coherent _¬ (edited by ¯(º_o)/¯ on 12-10-05 01:11 PM) |
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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Originally posted by ¯\(º_o)/¯ I've never seen anything else posted by Gavin, if he's joking, that's a good thing.  (edited by Thayer on 12-10-05 05:47 PM) |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6389 days Last view: 6332 days |
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Originally posted by ThayerOriginally posted by ¯\(º_o)/¯ Indeed I am . You might have normally seen some random postings by me in this forum, but I simply can't even begin to know how to respond to some of these things.. I mean half of these posts are just insane. "Many of you BS'n about Bush", what are you kidding me? It's like having an arguement with a 16 year old... oh wait.. 
And not that anyone under some certain age is incapable of mounting a good argument (and I'm sure there are many 15 and 16 year olds much more capable and articulate than many my own age), it's just that they (and anyone else saying anything rational) are overridden by the rest of the garbage. But actually, to answer the question: No, of course not. That question is just fucking absurd. Science is, as one definition puts it: "Methodological activity, discipline, or study". Science isn't some ubiquitous, tangible entity. It is simply fact building and discovering the in which we live. |
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Arwon Bazu Since: 11-18-05 From: Randwick, Sydney, NSW, Australia Last post: 6314 days Last view: 6313 days |
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| Do Christians believe in atoms? Gravity? | |||
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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| Yes, Christians use those examples to point out, that you do not have to see something to believe it. Most people who become believers usually see how someone gives an example. For those who 'dislike' Christians because there hypocrites, true, but isn't everyone? | |||
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| Not necessarily. Sure, individuals can be hypocrites, but many Christian institutions are inherently hypocritical.
And I mean, "dislike Christians"...I hate that saying. I mean, everything about America hates Christianity. Letting gays breath, allowing for a fair and balanced education free from elements of ANY religion. I mean, I'm going to be ecstatic the day when the bias against white men and Christians is removed! I'll only be happy about the state of America with regards to being unbiased against Christians and in fact SUPPORTIVE of Christian doctrine when it gets 43 white, male, Christian presidents...Wait. Didn't that happen? Like...ever since 1776? |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6389 days Last view: 6332 days |
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Originally posted by Bookworm I think you have a flawed view of what "science" is. As I stated previously, science is simply fact building, triangulating logic. It doesn't necessarily just explain things that are not seen, it is a standardized approach to proving things we hold to be true. My analogy would be to think of it like a proof in geometry. Everything that is prooven in science is held in place by a buttress of facts and research. That's what science is all about. Examples in religion aren't fact. The Bible is meant as allagory anyway, not to be given as true examples. They are stories to attempt to instill "proper" values that Christians wish to highlight in their followers. Simply stated, there will be no way to prove or disprove anything about Religion, it is not within our grasp as humans. This is why Religion and Science simply do not exist on the same plane. Science only deals with things that can and cannot be proven according to other truthes that were found in a similar process. However, in my opinion, some people get upset when humans advance to the point where they can answer some of the "unkowns" that previously only Religion could answer. |
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Clockworkz Birdon Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| Bookworm, I'm not fond of Christians for several reasons. Hypocrits, yes. Trying to make you believe in something else constantly, yes. Burning times in America and in Europe, yes. I dunno. I hold grudges. | |||
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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| Gavin: "The Bible is meant as allagory anyway"
They why can most of the history of it be proven from other sources? �\(�_o)/�: "Hypocrits, trying to make you believe in something else constantly" True, nobody is perfect, and you key word there is make. Christians can't make other Christians, it is up to the person to decide what he/she has to lose by believing. The first step is to realise you did something wrong, or your are a sinner. Originally posted by Mark 2:17 |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| ¯\(º_o)/¯: Flawed reasoning.
You see, the "burnings" in Europe hundreds of years ago were just that...hundreds of years ago. I don't hold any real grudges against the Canadian government or Russians/Georgians for what they've done to fuck over my family in this century. And I'm positive that I'm FAR more directly affected by the choices of those folk then you could ever be by the "burnings". Bookworm: Like? You mean because we have mounds of historical records, archaeological, anthropological, etc. articles that just SCREAM that the Garden of Eden existed, or that a crazy 12 headed beast descended from Heaven to chill with Ezekial? If you want to go by that proof, I guess that all other religions are true too. Most of them have a flood myth, and global flooding is a very real phenomenon. So, I guess the story of Gilgamesh must be taken as complete truth. We have historical evidence that something happened at the theoretical site of Troy, by your logic I guess Ares appeared in all his bloody glory there. I guess Paris chose the wrong goddess to give the gold to. Seriously, tell me several instances from the Old Testament that can be proven. Give me New Testament evidence that does not come from Rome (many of the documents may have been altered under the reign of Theodosius) or from Jewish sources (many were sympathetic to the Christo-Jews). Come on, if you want to boast about it show me something. |
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Phantomrain Newcomer Since: 12-02-05 Last post: 6745 days Last view: 6745 days |
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Originally posted by Ziff well, for starters, the flood. how do you think the grand canyon was created? seriously, do you really think that that pittifull little creek known as the Colorado river carved out the Grand Canyon? gimme a break!! and besides, the fossil record clearly shows evidence of a massive flood. those "billions of dead things burried in rock layers laid down by water all over the earth" didn't get there by themselves. the existence of dinosaurs, though completely screwed over by macro-evolutionists, was first mentioned in the Bible. And yes there is tons of evidence pointing to the existence of the Gardden of Eden. The records of egypt show evidence of the plagues and the exodus of the hebrews. secondly, Bookworm isn't boasting, he's pointing somthing out. get it through your head we're not boasting about anything, we're simply showing you the evidence you request and then defending ourselves when you ignore it and say we're f***ed in the head!! The Jews hated the Christians!! Especially the Pharisies and leaders and teachers of the law! The Christians were preaching against everything that the leaders had been pulling over the eyes of their followers for centuries!! Also there are non-Biblical and non-jewish historical accounts of Jesus existence and the begining of Christianity. The documents were nto altered durring anyone's reign. you keep asking for proof, yet you give us nothing to back up your own claims. show me passages that can be completely diproved! show me hard evidence that the documents were altered! your argument is so full of holes, if i didn't know better i'd think it was a sieve or a piece of swiss cheese! all your post is based on is hypothesis, rumors, a dislike for the Truth we're bringing to the table and a competetive nature that won't let you admit that you might possibly be wrong! you have no evidence! i'm leaving now before i get pissed off and say something i'll regret. ~Fear~ PS. Gavin, the Bible is not meant as an allegory. it is an historically accurate doccument containing Spiritual truths and a blueprint for life, both physical and spiritual. Unless you wrote the Bible, which i assure you, you did not, you cannot say how it was meant to be taken as you do not know the mind of the Almighty God. also, as a general statement, all people are hypocrits and many of the so called "Christian" establishments which are so hypocritical are neither Christian, nor have any affiliation with true Christian organizations. |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| Um, yeah. You do realize that following the death of Christ there was a thing called a change of opinion amongst main stream Jewish populations throughout the Roman Empire?
The Grand Canyon was carved out of the rock by MILLIONS of years of erosion and tectonic activity. I had to read a nice big article on it for my test on comparative planetary geology. Please, show me where the fossil record points out a massive flood. A global flood that occured about 5000 years ago. Please. I'd like to see all the dinosaurs that were wiped out during the Aryan invasions of India and the Doric invasions. Where is your evidence of the Gardden of Eden? Please. I'd like to see it. Where are these records of Egypt? Show me some. Look, stop posting. You've got nothing to add to the debate because you're adding no new information. You're using tired rhetoric that would make Quintillian roll his eyes.
Give me some proof as one Christian to another Christian. PS. Gavin, the Bible is not meant as an allegory. it is an historically accurate doccument containing Spiritual truths and a blueprint for life, both physical and spiritual. Unless you wrote the Bible, which i assure you, you did not, you cannot say how it was meant to be taken as you do not know the mind of the Almighty God. also, as a general statement, all people are hypocrits and many of the so called "Christian" establishments which are so hypocritical are neither Christian, nor have any affiliation with true Christian organizations. Dude, lots of Jews and the majority of Christians see the document as an allegorical enshrinement of values and oral tradition. The current definition of hypocrite is so skewed that it is completely disingenuous to be used in modern debate as it has become completely useless. So, would you like me to start listing hypocritical Christian organizations based off of modern definitions? How about all of them. And every other religion. |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6389 days Last view: 6332 days |
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Originally posted by PhantomrainOriginally posted by Ziff No, you're leaving because you realize you have absolutely nothing to back up any of your statements and that you're almost entirely full of shit . Oh really, I didn't write the Bible? Thanks for pointing that out, I was totally unaware that a document compiled hundreds and hundred of years before my conception was not authored by my humble self. No seriously, thanks for the grand fucking insights.
Going along the same logical lines you laid out in which I cannot decide the intention of the multiple authors of the bible, you too are unable to give motive for their writings. And I would be most pleased if you could iterate any of this "evidence" you're talking about and back it up with something. Weird, I've never before heard such an explination for the existance of the Grand Canyon. Probably some sort of left-wing Jewish conspiracy to deny the existance of the one true Lord. I have never denied the existance of a historical figure now known as Jesus Christ. So what if he existed. That speaks nothing to claims of his relationship with a higher heavenly figure. IIRC, Islam acknowledges the existance of Jesus Christ, they just don't think he was sent from heaven... I mean, the jews acknowledged a figure named Jesus Christ existed, didn't they? Whoopdie-fucking-doo. What a huge major victory in this argument you have one, "but wait, there is actually someone else who said that some events highlighted in the bible might have actually taken place!" Shouldn't we be surprised if these accounts aren't extensively talked about in every major historical record. And what exactly do they say specifically. Do they have accounts of burning bushes, do they talk about men walking on water with credible reports? Or do they just say, "there was a mass migration of peoples around the time of [X] ruler." P.S. I'm Jesus fucking Christ. |
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Clockworkz Birdon Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| Christians make me laugh.
I can understand stupid people needing the bible 2000 years ago for scaring them into order, but to actually say that 100% of the Bible is "truth", well that's just plain gullability. Trust me; I respect Christiannity and Christians, but it's these Fundies and Radicals that fuck the whole religion over with their bullshit, like believing every word in the bible to be truth. Bullshit. "And yes there is tons of evidence pointing to the existence of the Gardden of Eden." I want your sources and links to this "evidence". "how do you think the grand canyon was created? seriously, do you really think that that pittifull little creek known as the Colorado river carved out the Grand Canyon?" :lol: This needs no further comment. "those "billions of dead things burried in rock layers laid down by water all over the earth" didn't get there by themselves." Surprise! You're wrong again. It's called "extinction". you know; like when dinosaurs and saber-toothed cats died off millions of years ago? Before the "Creation"? Uh-oh! You failed! |
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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Originally posted by Ziff Originally posted by Leviticus 12:3 USAID Health: HIV/AIDS, Technical Areas, Research, Male Circumcision and HIV Prevention ¯\(º_o)/¯, Where do you get your evidence? Originally posted by Phantomrain That's why you think before you post, it's a little bit easier to do then thinking before speaking. Ps. Rain, I'm already pissed off, I'm just holding back. |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6389 days Last view: 6332 days |
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Originally posted by Bookworm Holding back anger or holding back some super-slam dunk argument. Because let me be the first to call your bluff if it's the latter |
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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| Seattle Post-Intelligencer: Mount St. Helens
There's your fast moving water, and quick carving of stone. Gavin, where do you get your evidence? |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6312 days Last view: 6312 days |
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| That's called volcanism. It's different than erosion and plate tectonics :o
Yes, because the HIV strain had evolved at the time Leviticus was written. That MUST be it! The Jews in the Middle East had to circumsize themselves because God told them about a sub-Saharan disease that didn't even exist at the time. That makes a lot of sense! |
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6313 days |
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| There was something about a cancer, but I can't remember the details. I'd have to look it up again.
Ziff, where do you get your evidence, and when was Leviticus written? |
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