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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - General Gaming - Game Designers: Information Needed |
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Snika Boo Level: 44  Posts: 122/916 EXP: 600678 For next: 10607 Since: 07-21-04 From: Freezing Cold Alaska! Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| Recently I discovered that my summer school teacher was friends with a guy who had helped design games such as Metal Gear and Dance Dance Revolution. I am assuming she meant that he was on the design team for these games, which brought me to several questions about these 'game designers.' I am wondering if these guys do any real programming. I mean, I think it'd be a really fun job if you could just think up games without having to strain your brain with programming the whole thing. I know how strainous programming is, so designing might be a good job if there is no programming. Another little red flag popped up in my head. Do these guys get paid good amounts? If I were one day to design a game for a big company like Nintendo or Microsoft, would I get paid enough to support myself and possibly family? Could I buy a big mansion in some remote beach in California? I am assuming they get paid enough to live. One other thing I was curious about is how much imput do these guys actually have in the game and what do they mostly do? I am assuming there is a lot of planning involved for the game, and designing of levels, and maybe even enemies. Please help me clear up my views about these game designers. I realize my ideas about this career may be naive, but I would be happy to get some clarification from you guys. =P Snika |
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GeckoYamori Paratroopa Level: 18 Posts: 37/153 EXP: 25084 For next: 4813 Since: 05-10-05 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 7 hours |
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| Some are programmers, some aren't. Some get paid a lot, some get paid less, it depends on where they're working. Sometimes they have complete authority on what the game should be like, sometimes it's a collaborative effort from the development team. These weren't excatly the best questions in the world. |
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Kasumi-Astra Administrator Level: 62  Posts: 1614/1867 EXP: 1971846 For next: 12840 Since: 03-15-04 From: Reading, UK Uni: Sheffield, UK Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 12 hours |
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| Game Designers will probably need some programming experience, but on a project they will not commonly program any of the game. What game designers do do is create an extensive document that covers every single detail of the game. Gameplay, music, level design, character design, story, control, AI, and code design right down to the lowest level will all be covered in a design document. Essentially, it's a step-by-step instruction manual for creating the game so that programmers and artists can follow each stage along and create the game. It is not, what many people believe, "just an idea" with a few cool drawings. Many documents run into hundreds of pages, exhaustively detailing what the game does and how it works. If the game designer is an architect, then the programmer is the builder. The builder has very little say in how the final building functions, and can only make improvements to the design to facilitate it's construction and final purpose. So, in terms of input, the designers have 99% control over a game. That's what they're there for. In general, computing jobs are well paid. If you become a high profile designer with several hits under your belt, you can garuntee you'll be well off for the rest of your life. However, if you go for a job at any prominent video games company, competition will be fierce. There will likely be tens if not hundreds of people going for a handful of jobs with each company. You will also find that the companies who create games for the major systems will only hire people with experience, meaning if you're not a games designer already, you're at an immediate disadvantage. However, that doesn't mean it's not impossible. The best way to get into the industry is to get involved with game development at the lowest level and build up a reputation and a portfolio. There are many homebrew projects that you can get involved in, providing you know your stuff and you work hard. It's volunteer work, but if you really want to stand a chance then you have to build a portfolio on your own. You could build a game of your own, or you could get involved with a group project. Games like Counterstrike and Desert Combat, mods that eventually had great influence over the future of their parent games and achieved remarkable success. "Bedroom programming" has been with games form the beginning, and is a good, honest way to get yourself started in the industry. (edited by Kasumi-Astra on 06-28-05 07:44 AM) |
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Dei* Nipper Plant Level: 26  Posts: 153/412 EXP: 97995 For next: 4280 Since: 06-18-05 From: USA, Florida Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 1 day |
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Still, game programming is like, tons upon tons of work.  I would think that most 'designers' think up ideas, sketches and such and have the programmers/modellers/spriters/testers do everything else. But I imagine that some developers DO help out as well. o.o |
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Yoronosuku Bullet Bill YORO 4 GOD Level: 32 Posts: 255/502 EXP: 194954 For next: 11488 Since: 01-06-05 From: hailing from Oyamazaki, Kyoto Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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| While Kasumi has it mostly all there, there are a few things that you must keep in mind. While she says that the programmers and other such people have little say in how the game goes, in some cases, they have the ONLY say. Alot of times, there are teams of map designers, and they will be given an outline of a scenery (a tropical island with many flowers, a burned out building, a black hole in space, but with more detail!) and the rest is left up to them. Because it is a team of map designers doing it all it will ensure that a new area will not conflict with already existing ones (for example, designing the exit to a building where there were clearly no doors on the outside, or a path leading to nowhere). The game designer will make sure that the maps suit his or her vision and will often times drop very stern hints and suggestions, and may even have some sketches of how they invisioned the map. But the people are given creative liscenses. The same would have to go for the sound team. It is split in to two usualy, though sometimes one man does it all. There is the Music crew and the sound effects crew. Each can range from 1 to a number of people (much like maps or any other aspect), and each is given an idea. The designer will go to the music crew and say for an instance, "this level is under-water. We need peacful music to set the mood". The musicians then go to write some music and pass it by the designer, and if he likes it then everyone is happy. Though alot of times, the musicians are simply given the 'scenario' and allowed to write how it is seen fit, and if the game designer has any stern suggestions in mind it will be noted before hand. Sound effects works a little differently. They need to wait for the game mechanics, so they can bring the sounds of all the game to life. As such, the designer will need to tell them what sort of sounds that the game will need. It does not always work this way, but in a typical team, it would work similarly. 2D games tend to follow this guidline a little bit closer than 3D games do, I have noticed. |
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Snika Boo Level: 44 Posts: 123/916 EXP: 600678 For next: 10607 Since: 07-21-04 From: Freezing Cold Alaska! Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| Thanks for the clarification you guys. I guess I never thought about the amount of detailed planning involved... Haha. I just had some thoughts left over from childhood about sketching little Marios and Goombas on a piece of paper and selling it to Nintendo for a million dollars. I think that game designing could possibly be a career I could find worth looking into. I better get cracking now and actually learn some decent programming lanuages. =P Snika |
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HyperLamer <||bass> and this was the soloution i thought of that was guarinteed to piss off the greatest amount of people Sesshomaru Tamaranian Level: 118 Posts: 5342/8210 EXP: 18171887 For next: 211027 Since: 03-15-04 From: Canada, w00t! LOL FAD Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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If you know how to work graphics systems (GDI, OpenGL, DirectX, or whatever you use), programming a simple 2D game engine actually isn't that hard. It's mostly debugging.  |
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Yoronosuku Bullet Bill YORO 4 GOD Level: 32 Posts: 263/502 EXP: 194954 For next: 11488 Since: 01-06-05 From: hailing from Oyamazaki, Kyoto Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 4 hours |
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Most companies will use engine cores given to them and modify them so that it suits how they like it. Zelda OoT was just Mario 64 with altered controlls and camera settings. Mario Tennis (AGB) was based off Golden Sun and more than half of all GBA titles use the sound engine included with the development kit. In this day and age, people are lucky enough to have alot of the grunt work automated for them, in a way  |
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Xeolord - B l u e s - Power Metal > All Level: 81  Posts: 2436/3418 EXP: 4884196 For next: 108653 Since: 03-15-04 From: Yeah Since last post: 15 hours Last activity: 15 hours |
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| This is a very broad question. Videogame production is just like any other thing out there in the work force, there's a ton to it. Last year for my Junior year I was in a Computers and Animation 2 class, and then Intro to Gaming. We did not -touch- any kind of programming at all, and it makes sense. "Design" is completely different from the "Programming" part. All you do is make things out of polygons and create models, environments, and many things like that. No programming skill is required at all. Then there's people entirely devoted to the programming side. It takes a lot of different things and work to make a game, so you just focus on what you're interested on and go from there. I know that's short and sweet, but my teacher knows what he's talking about, and it does make sense. Edit: I used to look into it, but yes Game Designers make a ton of money. If you're part of a team that makes a very successful game, you're good to go from there. My grandparents have told me that they know someone who's been a part of videogame making, and that family has so much money they just hand out cars. I think I remember reading up on the average income for a videogame designer, I believe it was like $60,000 to $250,000 yearly, last I can remember.  In short, yes, they make a heck of a lot of money, if they are successful. (edited by Xeomega on 06-29-05 01:45 PM) |
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GeckoYamori Paratroopa Level: 18 Posts: 64/153 EXP: 25084 For next: 4813 Since: 05-10-05 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 7 hours |
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| Sorry for bringing up an old thread, but recently an interview with a well known designer was posted which will hopefully be very helpful to you: http://www.gamer-girl.org/features/avelloneint2.html "First off, if you're interested in story and world creation, I would recommend trying to get established in the pen-and-paper game industry or in books or novels - game design requires a love of game mechanics, lists, and tons upon tons of rule sets." "when not actually arguing and throwing feces at each other through our cage bars, a large portion of a game designer's job is design documentation or writing 5000 emails. That means you need good technical writing skills and an ability to organize your thoughts. You need to be able to pass a document off to audio, QA, marketing, the programming staff, and an artist, and they should be able to find out whatever information they need just by looking at the document." "If you're looking for college classes to take, I'd suggest some programming courses and creative writing courses, maybe a little bit of art, and any classes that deal with interface design or layout for computer programs. Learn how to write critically and technically, and become familiar with Microsoft Word. Programming classes are a bonus because it helps designers understand how computers |
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