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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - War in Iraq |
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Can the war in Iraq be justified?| Yes |
41.7%, 10 votes | No |
50.0%, 12 votes | Don't know |
8.3%, 2 votes | Multi-voting is disabled.
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Dracoon Zelda The temp ban/forum ban bypasser! Level: 84  Posts: 3119/3727 EXP: 5514391 For next: 147561 Since: 03-25-04 From: At home Since last post: 5 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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| Sadam wasn't the worse dictator in the world or most dangerous. Why we went over there is really beyond me. We didn't go for the oil (Obvious because they are going after Alaska I think) and getting him out of power wouldn't be helpful to the world. I think its more of a "I'm finishing my dads war" thing. | |||
windwaker Ball and Chain Trooper WHY ALL THE MAYONNAISE HATE Level: 61  Posts: 1650/1797 EXP: 1860597 For next: 15999 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 4 days Last activity: 6 days |
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Originally posted by Legion Yes, but if you advocate killing for lower gas prices, then you should die. You too, geeo. |
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Legion banning people for no reason sure is fun Level: 101  Posts: 4346/5657 EXP: 10399737 For next: 317938 Since: 03-15-04 From: The Crossroads is under attack! Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 5 days |
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Originally posted by windwakerOriginally posted by Legion I never did. |
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windwaker Ball and Chain Trooper WHY ALL THE MAYONNAISE HATE Level: 61 Posts: 1654/1797 EXP: 1860597 For next: 15999 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 4 days Last activity: 6 days |
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| But geeogree did, and you responded with "people die, it happens". | |||
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Legion banning people for no reason sure is fun Level: 101 Posts: 4378/5657 EXP: 10399737 For next: 317938 Since: 03-15-04 From: The Crossroads is under attack! Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 5 days |
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Originally posted by windwaker And how does that imply that I'm for killing people to lower gas prices?  |
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Legault Bot Level: 24  Posts: 152/269 EXP: 78075 For next: 50 Since: 12-24-04 From: Schools out...YES!!! Summer vacation. Since last post: 13 days Last activity: 4 days |
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| Look no matter what gas prices aren't going to go down. Right now we have plenty of gas to last us for I think it was twenty years, and yet gas prices are as high as they have ever been. So killing people isn't going to help. Besides We allready have invaded Iraq under false pretences and now the rest of the world hates us because Bush went against the U.N. So even if we invade wherever the oil is no one besides the English are going to back us. | |||
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Legion banning people for no reason sure is fun Level: 101 Posts: 4384/5657 EXP: 10399737 For next: 317938 Since: 03-15-04 From: The Crossroads is under attack! Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 5 days |
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| Don't forget Poland! "Besides We allready have invaded Iraq under false pretences and now the rest of the world hates us because Bush went against the U.N." What are you talking about? They hated us before this whole shindig happened. |
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Legault Bot Level: 24 Posts: 156/269 EXP: 78075 For next: 50 Since: 12-24-04 From: Schools out...YES!!! Summer vacation. Since last post: 13 days Last activity: 4 days |
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| Yes, but this gave them full reason to hate us, maybe even start a war with us. Who do you think would win? The U.S. & England VS. The world? I am going to have to say the world on that one. So what if we have a ton of Nukes. Combined everyone else does to. Plus the biggest armies. Lets just hope they don't start a war because if so we are fucked. | |||
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Legion banning people for no reason sure is fun Level: 101 Posts: 4386/5657 EXP: 10399737 For next: 317938 Since: 03-15-04 From: The Crossroads is under attack! Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 5 days |
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Originally posted by Legault No one would win. Seriously, it would be the end of the world. It's not really a plausible question really. England wouldn't side with us, they would side with Europe. It would be stupid not to. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99  Posts: 4114/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Yeah, Leg is right (the good Leg). There can be no such thing as a world war anymore. It becomes a world ending affair once the super-powers of the world start batting eyelashes. |
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Legault Bot Level: 24 Posts: 160/269 EXP: 78075 For next: 50 Since: 12-24-04 From: Schools out...YES!!! Summer vacation. Since last post: 13 days Last activity: 4 days |
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| Once again us vs World and I know that it would be the end of the world but hey it has to happen some time. Eventually someone is going to get fed up with another country and then bam world gone. Just like this. |
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geeogree Bloober Level: 34  Posts: 367/448 EXP: 231583 For next: 22068 Since: 03-16-04 From: Calgary, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 11 hours |
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| whoa.... when did I say that killing people to lower gas prices was okay? I think what I said was.... if the war was actually for oil, then why haven't prices gone down... windwaker: you read too much into what people say.... way way too much |
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drjayphd Beamos What's that spell? pimp! Level: 56  Posts: 1099/1477 EXP: 1387410 For next: 10766 Since: 03-15-04 From: CT Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by geeogree Well, that's part of what you said: if the war was for oil.... then why aren't prices going down? it's been a while... shouldn't the oil be here by now.... I for one would be pleased if the oil from Iraq came over here and helped push the price down.... I don't see why anyone here should care... it'll save you money.... It's the last two (well, not really SENTENCES) blurbs? that are the problem. "You shouldn't care if we invaded a sovereign nation, because YOU WANT CHEAP GAS!" To which windwaker called you a heartless bastard. Not reading TOO much into it. In fact, in some ways, it could logically be construed to mean it is okay to kill for cheap gas. |
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geeogree Bloober Level: 34 Posts: 368/448 EXP: 231583 For next: 22068 Since: 03-16-04 From: Calgary, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 11 hours |
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| well.... maybe it's because gas hasn't gone down.... my point was not that killing for gas was okay... but that it obviously hadn't happened, or gas would be cheaper... |
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windwaker Ball and Chain Trooper WHY ALL THE MAYONNAISE HATE Level: 61 Posts: 1655/1797 EXP: 1860597 For next: 15999 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 4 days Last activity: 6 days |
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Originally posted by LegionOriginally posted by windwaker Nevermind, I thought you were calling me an extremist for saying killing for lower gas prices is bad. And geeogree, you said that gas prices going down should make us happy. 1) killing's bad. 2) it just means the government can tax us more.  |
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Dei* Nipper Plant Level: 26  Posts: 42/412 EXP: 97995 For next: 4280 Since: 06-18-05 From: USA, Florida Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 1 day |
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if the war was for oil.... then why aren't prices going down? it's been a while... shouldn't the oil be here by now.... I for one would be pleased if the oil from Iraq came over here and helped push the price down.... I don't see why anyone here should care... it'll save you money.... Here's what I think is why even though we can get more oil, if indeed this war was for such, then why AREN'T the prices going down? Here's why: Opec and other major companies say they are at max production limits. Doesn't this seem a bit strange to you? We invade Iraq which has tons of oil, and remarkably the gas prices SOAR to unheard of levels. And are continuing to rise. IT's not like we dont have enough oil already, so why is this happening? I believe the gas companies are milking it for all its worth, keep putting up such and such excuses just so they can have us consumers pay top dollar for oil/gas. Either way, we lose, they win. Common sense, I think. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 4226/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Alright. I'm going to post this for the last time. Iraq's oil fields are NOT producing at anything close to peak capacity. The pipelines are totally a waste, and it will take years to finsih building them. And even then, Iraq is only ONE part of the world's oil supply. The reason why prices are soaring is because... A) Venezuela. They are trying to keep oil in South America and create a more autonomus area. The governments are all politically similar, and after decades and decades of US interference with their affairs it appears that they like freedom. Economic, political and that freedom without ruthless oppression (*cough* Chile *cough*) B) Norway. They are trying to raise the output of oil, but the workers are being screwed over by the companies, thus, like other workers who are being shafted, they're planning to strike! C) Various African exporters are being shut down right now because the workers are striking due to HORRIBLE working conditions. D) European and North American markets aren't the only markets out there. There are two nations with more than Europe's and North America's total populations combined eating up oil like no tomorrow in their race to full modernization of industry. They're called China and India. E) Russia. One of the world's biggest exporters is in a terrible mess right now, the major company, YUKOS, was shut down due to tax evasion. When your largest exporter suddenly stops exporting, that means your exports go down. That means world oil supplies become limited. Expect Russian oil to start flowing again within a few years. F) A very important oil exec. from Germany was recentely kidnapped, spurring fears of terrorist attacks on various oil installations. G) Canadian oil, which is the largest supply on the planet now, is very expensive to refine. Within a decade you'll see a major shift in world power to Canada, which will be the world's primary oil exporter and controller of that resource. Right now, the oil is considerably lower quality and expensive. H) Liquid natural gas is being increasingly used to make gasoline. Which is an expensive process. It, like crude, is in dwindling supplies. Therefore, the prices go up. I) The US Strategic Reserve is too small, and it lacks the economic firepower necessary to lower the commodity prices to an extreme degree. There are tonnes of other reasons, too. Like the really big lack of transcontinental pipelines in Asia, which are now being built, that slow production down. Either way, OPEC can't meet demands anymore, and the peak oil capacity has been reached and shattered. edit:: Winter heating supplies get hoarded during the summer, which means that they are being bought off the market. And then, they get sold during the winter, after prices do the usual fall in the fall and the jump in the winter. (edited by Ziff on 06-21-05 12:33 PM) |
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CityGirl Micro-Goomba Level: 6 Posts: 3/13 EXP: 539 For next: 368 Since: 06-23-05 Since last post: 111 days Last activity: 111 days |
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Originally posted by Ziff Was WWII immoral? It brought about the freeing of millions of innocent people, and it also put an end to the wide-scale acceptance of anti-semitism in the world that had existed until then. I'm not a war-monger, but in Catholicism there is a concept of the "Just War" and Islam, too has it's own verson of this: Jihad, or translated, "struggle." Whether one believes in a religion or not, war is something many of the world's great thinkers have spent time justifying rooted in morality. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 4257/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Yes! It was immoral. Do you think they did it to stop the Holocaust? NO! They did it to bolster economy and to protect vested interests in the areas. If they did it to save the Jews perhaps our great nations wouldn't have turned them away and effectively sent them back into Germany. Actually, CityGirl, "Just War" was limited at the Council of Trent and then gotten rid of during the Vatican II. And Jihad was initially an internalized concept relating to battling negative elements within one's own being and soul. |
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Mr. Monday Newcomer Level: 3  Posts: 5/5 EXP: 117 For next: 11 Since: 07-14-05 Since last post: 111 days Last activity: 111 days |
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| If we have the power to overthrow a dictator killing hundreds of thousands of his own people why shouldn't we. WE took out stalin, and hitler, sadame was in need of his end. |
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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - War in Iraq |
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