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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - Why do you stay away from religion? |
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drjayphd Beamos What's that spell? pimp! Level: 56  Posts: 1290/1477 EXP: 1387410 For next: 10766 Since: 03-15-04 From: CT Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by alte Hexe I'm guessing the conflict's more Roman Catholic v. various Protestant denominations, yes, Zer0wned? Just look at a few of the statements made by a variety of self-appointed Southern Baptist spokesmen re: the Pope. |
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Zer0wned Cheep-cheep Level: 17  Posts: 41/181 EXP: 21472 For next: 3271 Since: 08-16-05 From: Hermosa Beach, CA Since last post: 30 days Last activity: 30 days |
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Originally posted by drjayphd Actually, I was really only commenting on the apparent comparison that made Catholics out to not be Christians, and then I offered a possible re-phrase that might make the statement make more sense. I really have no idea on these things. |
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Cirvante Shyguy Level: 14  Posts: 70/80 EXP: 10353 For next: 2718 Since: 04-07-05 From: The boulevard of broken dreams Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 7 hours |
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Ah yes, Pope Benedict XVI. He isn't going to make this any easier. Have you heard the guy speak? He's always 'condemn this, condemn that" He's the Pope, for God's sake! He could solve some of the more complicated world issues that the governments fear to touch. (edited by Cirvante on 08-30-05 09:28 PM) |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99  Posts: 5240/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| ...Have you listened to a Pope for the last...Oh...1800 years? | |||
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Cirvante Shyguy Level: 14 Posts: 71/80 EXP: 10353 For next: 2718 Since: 04-07-05 From: The boulevard of broken dreams Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 7 hours |
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Originally posted by alte Hexe Nope. Only for the last ten. *sigh* You're right, I shouldn't get my hopes up. |
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Tommathy Level: 21  Posts: 140/145 EXP: 42543 For next: 7400 Since: 03-18-04 From: Cloud Nine, Turn Left and I'm There~ Since last post: 25 days Last activity: 1 day |
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| Religion doesn't cause war; differences do. We make war because the other person has more stuff, has more land, is weaker, talks funny, dresses different, smells bad, whatever. If you want world peace, quite frankly, you're going to have to eliminate any sort of inequalities or differences between people. And then, quite frankly, life wouldn't be worth living. I am religious; I believe there is more to creation, and existence, than what we know through the lenses of reason and perception. I have faith life has purpose and meaning, and that we're more than just very complex, self-sustaining chemical reactions. I believe love and beauty are more than just evolutionary tricks that help perpetuate the species, and that we all actually do have sentience, and really do have thoughts and feelings, not simply well-organized synaptic static. Two notes on Christianity (although I'm not Christian) "Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." -Matthew 22:37-40 "Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres." -Corinthians 13:04-07 |
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geeogree Bloober Level: 34  Posts: 400/448 EXP: 231583 For next: 22068 Since: 03-16-04 From: Calgary, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 11 hours |
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Originally posted by Tommathy I don't think that is true. I think what the world lacks is tolerance. And by tolerance I don't mean that everyone is totally equal and no one is different and people aren't allowed to be different or point out differences. Edit: "Also, this idea that offending someone is somehow a crime is getting old. I'm tired of not being allowed to say what I want for the sake of not offending someone." That's not tolerance. Tolerance is about knowing and accepting differences and instead of using those differences against each other, they are used to build each other up. If people would stop treating someone that is different with contempt or distrust the world could be peaceful. Unfortunately there is always someone who thinks that they are getting the short end of the stick and they feel the only way to be heard is to be louder than anyone else. (edited by geeogree on 09-01-05 01:31 AM) |
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Ares Blue Octorok Level: 12 Posts: 41/47 EXP: 7857 For next: 64 Since: 03-17-04 From: Uh...Olympus....yes, that will do..... Since last post: 12 days Last activity: 7 days |
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| Catholics vs. Protestants. Yeesh, guys, that was a minor flub! I'd hate to see what would happen if somebody actually said something truly ambiguous? | |||
Jovis Octorok Level: 8  Posts: 26/34 EXP: 1587 For next: 600 Since: 08-30-05 From: North Country, New York Since last post: 56 days Last activity: 22 days |
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| I stay away from religion because of the problems it can cause. A lot of people prosecute you for your religion and don't even bother to get to know you just because you believe in something other than them. Plus, I haven't had many chances in life to enjoy myself and would just end up blaming unseen gods if I could. I rather not sink that low :/ |
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SamuraiX Paratroopa Level: 19 Posts: 9/140 EXP: 32602 For next: 3175 Since: 10-11-04 From: ^___^ Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Religious debate is an oxymoron, but there is a lot of religious argument. By this, I mean that religion is based on faith, not logic. | |||
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geeogree Bloober Level: 34 Posts: 403/448 EXP: 231583 For next: 22068 Since: 03-16-04 From: Calgary, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 11 hours |
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| so anything based on faith is bogus? well, you just your entire existence out the window  |
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Thayer Fuzz Ball Level: 38  Posts: 328/988 EXP: 349428 For next: 21019 Since: 06-28-05 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 1 day |
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| A debate is a discussion where opposing points spar with each other. I find it difficult to see how religion can necessarily be excluded from such. | |||
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SamuraiX Paratroopa Level: 19 Posts: 10/140 EXP: 32602 For next: 3175 Since: 10-11-04 From: ^___^ Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| I was talking about the premises of a debate, since religious based arguments have little or no backup. "Because god said so" is a really shitty standard for a debate. There is no evidence of god, unless you make up one (bad idea). |
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Thayer Fuzz Ball Level: 38 Posts: 395/988 EXP: 349428 For next: 21019 Since: 06-28-05 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 1 day |
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| Not all religions have gods. | |||
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Zer0wned Cheep-cheep Level: 17 Posts: 72/181 EXP: 21472 For next: 3271 Since: 08-16-05 From: Hermosa Beach, CA Since last post: 30 days Last activity: 30 days |
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| *re·li·gion (rĭ-lĭj'ən) n. 1. 1. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe. 2. A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship. 2. The life or condition of a person in a religious order. 3. A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader. 4. A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion. Yup, according to definitions 3 & 4, he's right. I'll be damned, I didn't think the un-God/Allah/Shiva&company/etc'd ones fell under that definition But I never seem to see much trouble from the non-theistic forms (not in the sense that they are a certain religion and cause problems, but cause problems in the name of their religion). Then again, I haven't been around long, and it's been becoming more and more clear to me that I was given a horrible education  ...That Shiva & company comment wasn't offensive, was it? I'm not too learn'd on Hinduism. *Definition from www.answers.com |
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Ares Blue Octorok Level: 12 Posts: 43/47 EXP: 7857 For next: 64 Since: 03-17-04 From: Uh...Olympus....yes, that will do..... Since last post: 12 days Last activity: 7 days |
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Originally posted by SamuraiX Folks, I present to you, my example of a logical thinker! Actually chief, the fine art of rhetoric was crafted with the intent for use in philisophical debates, your "backup" never has to be actual physical evidence (hells bells, if that were true, half of science goes right out the window on that one) but rhetorical reasoning ability. "If suchinsuch is suchinso, then it follows that" ect. Now, I'm not insulting you, I would never insult someone with such a kick A Kenshin themed layout.  All I'm saying is that you are definitly a logical thinker, you probably see people with their head in the clouds and think poorly of them....but really in the end like my ealier post said, its all about what your wired for. Read a book on rhetoric and philosphy guys, or take a class or something, always try to expand your horizons..(now this is starting to sound like an after-school special..) |
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Zer0wned Cheep-cheep Level: 17 Posts: 74/181 EXP: 21472 For next: 3271 Since: 08-16-05 From: Hermosa Beach, CA Since last post: 30 days Last activity: 30 days |
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| So following that premise, I could create a dozen complete BS, but self containing religions, and they would hold some value, so long as there were no staggering internal self contradictions, and remained consistant with external evidence (sometimes not even then)? Religion is here to/is used for: #1- Put away the fear of death, teach people to accept it, even look forward to it when it comes #2- Instill a feeling of meaning and purpose in those who cannot find their own place in life #3- silence the wandering mind (for better or worse) #4- (my favorite) Controlling the masses through exploitation, intimidation, guilt, and harmless unity (once again, for better or worse). #5- Humanize the calamity of life (a diety's will or intervention, sometimes involving a master plan; as opposed to just a big number game). You see what's happening here? These are, for the most part, the roles of a great leader, and since a real one is so hard to come by, people conjure up one or several, or follow teachings of a long since dead leader to fill holes when one is not there (even when one is there, with how strongly founded religion is now). Pride, envy, lust, gluttony, wrath, greed and sloth. Sins now, but were seven primal urges that aided in survival in the way back when (I say sloth because the strive for it had to have had some positive effects on survival). They've been obsolete in most settings for a long time, just like that primal urge for a leader is now. Social order doesn't require a leader so much as it needs guidelines and rules (and those who enforce them), but we're still hard-wired to need one. I think need for self worth, and fear of timely death are both pretty pointless as well, but I doubt most people would agree with me there  .I will, right now go on record on saying that I firmly believe that every single existing religion is wrong, whether it makes sense or not. Divine powers, cosmic powers, gods, God, these cannot be 100% disproven, I will admit this. Just as they cannot be proven. But the chances that any of the existing religious theories are correct are so slim, Infinitesimal even, that I can confidently say that they are all false. Now I can only fairly guess about a 50% (I'd personally say 25%) chance of a true (currently followed or not) religion, as opposed to a completely logical universe, where there is no supernatural, where everything has a logical explaination, although probably impossible for humans to discover. EDIT: F***ing typos!!!! (edited by Zer0wned on 09-08-05 11:40 PM) |
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Tamarin Calanis We exist. Earth exists. The universe exists. Do we really need to know why? Level: 59 Posts: 826/1802 EXP: 1672751 For next: 377 Since: 07-12-04 From: The gas station on the corner... Since last post: 5 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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Originally posted by geeogreeErm, that makes no sense whatsoever. I'm here. Where's the faith needed for that?  And SamuraiX, please stop with the scrolling smilies. |
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geeogree Bloober Level: 34 Posts: 409/448 EXP: 231583 For next: 22068 Since: 03-16-04 From: Calgary, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 11 hours |
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| I've been waiting for someone to ask everything you do is based on faith... everything. You get up out of bed because you believe you can. If you didn't believe you could, you would never try. I could give you example after example... but hopefully the one will do. |
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Zer0wned Cheep-cheep Level: 17 Posts: 80/181 EXP: 21472 For next: 3271 Since: 08-16-05 From: Hermosa Beach, CA Since last post: 30 days Last activity: 30 days |
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Originally posted by geeogree ... wrong definition of faith there, geeogree. |
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