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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - Why do you stay away from religion? |
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DarkSlaya POOOOOOOOOOOORN! Level: 88 Posts: 3636/4249 EXP: 6409254 For next: 241410 Since: 05-16-04 From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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| I like this question. I used to believe, to go to church every Sundays. That was long ago, before I saw the truth (for me at least) behind religions. There were times were religion was used as an excuse for war, for killing (Holy Wars). People were "defending" their religion by either forcing people to share their beliefs, or by killing. There were bloodbaths because of religion. Just how I'm I supposed to have faith in a thing that got so many people killed (I'm talking about religions as a whole, not just Christianity). Really, I'm seeing people talk as if God(if such being exists) approves everything he does (ain't gonna say names). I say this is plain wrong (from my point of view on the matter). Also, I shorter answer: I'm a man of sciences, I don't believe in something that I don't have much proofs about (some old books that had lots of translations and were re-written more than enough times don't count). |
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Slay Level: 25 Posts: 33/339 EXP: 85592 For next: 4028 Since: 04-28-05 From: Threshold Between Heaven and Hell Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 1 day |
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| I am spiritual, but not religious. I believe that all life is equal. I believe that every living thing, including animal and plant, has a spirit, and none is greater than any other. I don't see humans as the overlords or arbiters of this planet, we're simply another creature like any other, and nature pays us no special attention over any others. I believe our spirits are devoid of gender, because sex is a thing of the corporeal world, not the spiritual world. I don't see a distinction between sacred and non-sacred, and I believe that the spirit world and physical world are almost one in the same, without a clearly defined boundry between the two. I do not believe that any special type of person can contact or speak for the spirits, but we can all channel spirits by emptying our minds and entertaining the unfamiliar, foreign thoughts which come to us. I believe that there is one spirit which is greater, wiser and older than all the rest. You can call this "god" if you like, I choose not to attach worldly labels to it. We can only come into communion with the great spirit in death, after our spirits detach from our worldly bodies. I'm not sure what happens from there. An afterlife, or perhaps the great spirit directs us in reincarnation. I believe that since we cannot enter the world of the spirits until after death, and since there might not be such a thing anyway, that we should pay more attention to worldly issues for the time being. I don't have any special ceremonies or sacred objects, however I do pray daily. I pray to the spirits of the animals and plants which I have disturbed or destroyed. The plants that are made into products I use, the animals I eat. I try to honor their spirits as best I can. I do not see any religion as "wrong," simply more complex than necessary, often too invasive, and very often disrespectful towards the spirits of the animals and plants. But it's just as likely that I'll simply rot in the ground when I die, I could very well be wrong. I don't seek console in the great spirit, I've never sought a guide to tell me what to do, I live by my own morals and ideals, I am highly independant. I don't think that other people should follow in my beliefs, unless they want to. I do, however, think it's morally objectionable when humans feel they are divine above all other life, and when people destroy life without paying respect. Other than that, my morals are seperate from my spiritual beliefs. The one thing I believe in above all else is that we are all equal. All life, not just human, is deserving of equal respect and treatment. But I'm not vegan or ignorant of the ways of the wild; animals eat each other, and since we are equal to them, we should eat meat if we want as well. I don't think that animals have the mental capacity to respect the life which they take and I don't think they consciously contribute to the betterment of the planet, they're just trying to survive, but since we humans have much more advanced brains and thinking capacity, we owe it to the planet to respect the life we end for our own purposes, whether survivial or luxury. One keen distinction I must make is that there is no such thing as "good" or "evil," nor do I believe in "sin." I arrived at this thinking because I don't believe that there is a god which keeps tally of our actions and requires us to preform special ceremonies to rid ourselves of "sin," so the distinction becomes useless. Furthermore, one man's good is another man's evil, so the use of the terms becomes fruitless, and the terms themselves become meaningless. I do, however, make the distinction between positive and negative. Positive things are those which act beneficial to worldly life; aiding the sick, planting seeds where you fell trees, things of the such. Negative things are those which act detrimental to worldly life; reasonless killing or harming of life, stealing that which you did not earn, things like that. I do not believe that positivity and negativity exist in the realm of the mental, the abstract, the spiritual. Thinking things can never hurt someone, and no action you could possibly take in this world could ever affect the spirits, so distinctions between what is right and wrong to do should be made on a basis of pure corporeal matters. In other words, I don't see other religious practices as sacrilege, nor do I see homosexuality as wrong. The one thing that I absolutely abolish is the act of idolization. By that I mean, overmuch interest in and devotion towards worldly things, to the point of ignoring one's own life. And by that I mean, we shouldn't hold certain people in high esteem over all others, we shouldn't take a single person to be the example of rightness and strive to imitate him or her, we should pay more attention to our personal lives; self-contemplation and self-consciouness, the people around us, our families and loved ones. The biggest culprit of idolatry exists in our mass media. Many people spend their free time contemplating the lives of celebrities or other famous figures - who's dating who, where so and so goes to eat, who is or isn't gay - and in this process, their own lives become dull because they never seek to enrich them. Self-contemplation is the most noble thing I can think of. We should all strive to know ourselves, to achieve high levels of self-consciouness, not mull over celebrities or athority figures, or even other people in our personal lives who we see as better off than ourselves. Jealousy is highly reprehensible in my mind. But above all, I believe in the Absolute. The Absolute is a concept I came up with after coming to the realization that all things in life are subject to change, everything is a matter of viewpoint and opinion. There is but one constant in this vast, rolling sea of inconsistancy; the self. The self is absolute, you are the only person who you can control, and therefore the only predictable consistancy in your life. This is why I stress the importance of introspection. To love oneself is to truly know what it is to be alive. |
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theclaw Red Cheep-cheep Level: 24  Posts: 161/202 EXP: 69367 For next: 8758 Since: 03-28-04 From: USA Since last post: 21 hours Last activity: 7 min. |
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| It's awful for people like me. Knowing that probably 2/3 of your family, and who knows how many of my best friends' relatives follow religion in some way. It's fairly simple. I'll never allow myself to read their propaganda. Bibles, Qurans, whatever. It's mass-brainwashing in my opinion. Sure some of the historical facts are true (like Eygpt is a real region of the earth), and the "prophets" were typical humans. But, angels, god(s), parting of an ocean, and such things are nonsense. I try to stay quiet about this in public though. Once these ideas are stuck in a person, they tend to in it forever. Explaining anything only seems to make them more defensive. The wikipedia entry on "problem of evil" sums up a lot of why I've denouced any and all religious practices. Church isn't too bad when they're just talking about astromony, which has complete scientific evidence. But, the moment "god" enters the subject I get POed. For all I care those preachers and ministers can go to what they call "hell". Which again doesn't exist according to me. I also denounce swearing alligence to nations, tobacco use, and other things which can permanently affect people's minds. What I'd call an afterlife is only how you are remembered by fellow humans. It's peer-to-peer, no deity involved. Being univerally loved or hated is impossible. Someone will always agree or disagree with one of your ideas no matter what it may be like. It goes: As long as religion of any form occurs on earth, there will be no peace. That still does not guarantee it though. Other issues like oil, food, and natural resources may be in dispute as well. In fact, I think devoting a vast majority of your life to any cause is a religion. This is why I do not believe in marriage. I also won't assign labels to myself. While many "god believers" would call me an atheist after hearing my beliefs, that's a religious form too. My bottom line is that I follow nothing. Asking others to worship me even violates these principals. Thank you, and good bye. | |||
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Legion banning people for no reason sure is fun Level: 101  Posts: 4930/5657 EXP: 10399737 For next: 317938 Since: 03-15-04 From: The Crossroads is under attack! Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 5 days |
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Originally posted by theclaw Maybe so, but that shouldn't stop you from reading it. If you're going to be anti-religious, it's best to actually know and understand what exactly anti you are about it. Basically, know the whole subject matter. "As long as religion of any form occurs on earth, there will be no peace." Close, but replace "religion" with "humanity". Religion is a huge scapegoat when it comes to the world's problems. Sure it does cause many of them, no denying that. But even if religion in any form were to have never existed, we'd still be having wars and turmoil amonst ourselves. We would just find another reason to fight. That's our way, that's our nature. |
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geeogree Bloober Level: 34  Posts: 392/448 EXP: 231583 For next: 22068 Since: 03-16-04 From: Calgary, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 11 hours |
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| if people followed what the religion taught then wars wouldn't exist.... I don't know many religions that advocate killing people.... none of the major religions ever did.... it was a few people in those religions that felt they could use religion to start wars and instigate crusades etc. Jesus taught to turn the other cheek.... get hit twice rather than hit back.... too bad no one lives like that anymore.... the world would be a better place if people stopped claiming to be something, and instead actually were what they claimed to be |
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drjayphd Beamos What's that spell? pimp! Level: 56  Posts: 1240/1477 EXP: 1387410 For next: 10766 Since: 03-15-04 From: CT Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| It's all about fundamentalism (look up "fundament" if you wanna know my thoughts on the real meaning). Simple solutions for simple people. (I'm referring to all denominations, not fundamentalist Islam. Actually, I'm thinking more of fundamentalist Christianity. Neener neener.) If people lived by the spirit of the tenets rather than the letter of specific passages, you would find that life would be much better. | |||
Bella Ludwig Von Koopa You're Gonna Love Me Level: 76  Posts: 1707/2962 EXP: 3891483 For next: 114577 Since: 03-29-04 From: Groovy Way Since last post: 8 min. Last activity: 6 min. |
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| I'm not big on religion or stuck on going to church every Sunday. I don't know why but my parents are Catholics and haven't forced me to church. They don't go to church themselves often. If my mom does go, it's to a Christian churche because she says she likes the people. My parents say they don't because they were forced to go to church every Sunday and the Communion and stuff like that but didn't like to be forced so I guess they didn't want to force us. Since religion wasn't pushed onto me in any way, I haven't really put thought into it. In some ways I did when I did go to church but then I would wonder how it would help me. You always hear stories from people who say that they were having a horrible life but turned to God and ended up turning their whole lives around. Not everyone follows the bible completely. They are swayed by society, through other people or friends. I'm confused with religion. I've read trough Genesis a few times and in the kids bible and that's all I really got from it. I would like to see what this religion thing and going to church is all about. For now all I can say is that I believe in God. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99  Posts: 5034/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by Bella Do what I did when my mom was putting me through the paces. Go to every major religious institution in your community (Hindu, Buddhist, Jewish, Roman Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant, whatever) and talk to them about religion and feel around until you find out what is best on your views of the world. I chose the Catholic Church.  |
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Danielle Local Moderator  Level: 76  Posts: 1662/3359 EXP: 3958078 For next: 47982 Since: 09-15-04 From: RATE Since last post: 3 hours Last activity: 3 hours |
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| I stay away from religion because that's how I was raised. Neither of my parents are very religious, I didn't go to church unless it was with my older sister (she decided to become a believer when she was about 17) or with a friend. Now that my sister is a mom with 2 boys, she has gotten them into private christian schools and they know verses from the bible and lots of other things.. much more than I do. So it just depends on what you learn growing up, for the most part. I don't know who encouraged my sister to read the bible, but she's happy she did. I don't question religion because I don't think there's a way to prove anything. I just accept it for what it is, and allow it to pass me by. |
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ClockExplosion Red Goomba Level: 10  Posts: 45/46 EXP: 3573 For next: 841 Since: 06-24-05 From: Fort Worth, Tejas Since last post: 78 days Last activity: 60 days |
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| I am an unorthodox Christian...I believe not in the religion, but in the philosophy. I also adopt other philosophies as well, but I consider myself a Christian mostly. But on whole, I don't like to think about it. Religion causes holy wars. I believe that everyone should choose their own philosophies, and follow that. |
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Cornellius Buster Beetle Level: 33  Posts: 362/460 EXP: 224182 For next: 4997 Since: 06-04-04 From: Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 3 days Last activity: 10 hours |
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| I believe in what I can see. Religions are responsible for many wars. They all say their religion promote liberty, but they end up in wars and mass killing. I think of religion as a "free psychologist". It's something that people can rely on in their hard times but not something you have to follow to the letter or something bad will happen. If it can hell people, it's fine, but I like to think by myself, to do my own conclusions in life. I don't believe in any form of god, magic, miracles, etc. I'm more like a scientist. I live with my instincs and feelings, I do not think about anything else to tell me what to do in life. | |||
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Bio Buster Beetle Level: 27  Posts: 91/458 EXP: 107144 For next: 9015 Since: 07-06-05 From: a laboratory somewhere... Waiting to be completed Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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| Talking about religion,the holy bible never talk about satan/lucifer/whatever and hell these two thing are from Grec religion there where only solen because they need fear to brain-wash people |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 5112/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by Bio Yes they do. And yes they did. They took the name Lucifer, which was the Roman god of light and learning. And used him to effectively dumb down the Pagan remnants. But the thing was, it was the Cult of Sol Invictus that started this process. It was being done to bolster internal strength for the Emperor. |
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Legion banning people for no reason sure is fun Level: 101 Posts: 5043/5657 EXP: 10399737 For next: 317938 Since: 03-15-04 From: The Crossroads is under attack! Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 5 days |
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| "As soon as we lose the moral basis, we cease to be religious. There is no such thing as religion over-riding morality. Man, for instance, cannot be untruthful, cruel or incontinent and claim to have God on his side." Ah, one of my favorite Ghandi quotes. |
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Edea Red Goomba Level: 8 Posts: 8/36 EXP: 1824 For next: 363 Since: 08-23-05 Since last post: 11 days Last activity: 11 days |
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| It's already been said: religion is not necessarily spirituality, and spirituality is not necessarily religion. I also stay away from religion, because it's what another human being decrees as 'right.' I'll think for myself, since their opinion is no better than my own. Its true purpose, at least long ago, was to unite a group of people under a common banner so that ffears within were assuaged and the group in question became better able to 'deal with' other groups. |
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Zer0wned Cheep-cheep Level: 17  Posts: 34/181 EXP: 21472 For next: 3271 Since: 08-16-05 From: Hermosa Beach, CA Since last post: 30 days Last activity: 30 days |
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| Hypothesis: If conditions A, B, C, D, E, and F are all true, then G is true. Information to work with A is assumed to be true B is true C is false. D is true E is self-conditional, and thusly always true F is true Therefore, C must be changed to the new true value, documentation stating the conditions must be rewritten to includ the new C, and pretend that never happened. Conclusion: G is a load of crock =P If the original, disproven values never changed, christianity would look ridiculous and therefore lose popularity. Kind of like scientology, just without a crazy celebrity spokesperson saying "T3h mapzorz and explorers lie! the world is flat! Dianetics cured my dyslexia!"... oops, got mixed up there a sec. |
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Cirvante Shyguy Level: 14  Posts: 66/80 EXP: 10353 For next: 2718 Since: 04-07-05 From: The boulevard of broken dreams Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 7 hours |
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The problem lies not in the religion itself; but in the men who lead and administer it. Take Islam, for example. Crazy people who claim to be "spiritual leaders" but lead their followers to war and bloodshed (they call it "jihad"), completely contradicting Islam's basic principles. So should we say that Islam, and therefore, Muslims, are evil? I don't think so. The ayatollahs are the real cause, not the people. Hell, even Catholicism has its problems. They have become so ritualistic that it's basically become almost irrecognizable from what it used to be: a simple religion that preached love of God and of others. Now, Catholic leaders spend their time condemning roughly 90% of everything that exists in this world instead of focusing on much more important matters, like the millions of children that are dying of hunger in Africa, Asia, and other parts of the world. And this is coming from a hard-raised Catholic. I've been forced to go to church every Sunday at 9 a.m. (my mom is one of the most religious persons on the planet) |
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Ares Blue Octorok Level: 12 Posts: 37/47 EXP: 7857 For next: 64 Since: 03-17-04 From: Uh...Olympus....yes, that will do..... Since last post: 12 days Last activity: 7 days |
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| "because it just doesn't make sense" I'm hearing this a lot, and I think its the heart of the issue as to why stay, or run from religious thought. I have a theory about human thought: A person has two fundamentally two types of thinker: logical and abstract (I don't mean abstract like extrapolation and other parts of scientific thought, just chill) by logical I'm saying this: pro: needs hard evidence, highly skeptical, doesn't get taken in or fooled. con: blanket denial even when confronted with overwhelming circumstancial and even a little documented evidence (think historians and the JFK assasination) lacks the ability to "pick up the hint" i.e. literal. Tends to be dogmatic with the scientific community. (think James Randi, I love the 'ol boy but he needs to bottle the acid) Abstract: pro: born philosophers. can watch the clouds go by. CAN "pick up the hint" highly intuitive. con: highly intuitive. can watch clouds go by. can get taken in and sometimes even thrown into the fervor. can be dogmatic about world view. (think over-the-top religious zeal, like Catholic vs. Christianity) |
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Zer0wned Cheep-cheep Level: 17 Posts: 40/181 EXP: 21472 For next: 3271 Since: 08-16-05 From: Hermosa Beach, CA Since last post: 30 days Last activity: 30 days |
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Originally posted by Ares ... I wasn't going to post in the acmlm boards for a while for my own reasons, but dude. Did I miss something, or did you honestly say "Catholic vs. Christianity", as if Catholics weren't Cristians? Maybe Catholics against the rest of Christianity maybe. In any case I think you meant "Catholicism" in that context. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 5224/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Given that most Christians are Catholics and all Catholics are Christians... |
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