Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - Programming - Visual Studio Express Beta 1 - FREE Visual Basic.NET.
| User | Post |
Jesper
Posts: 543/2390 |
Originally posted by Drag
I have a retail version of VB5-Learner's Edition, and I can compile my EXEs with it. If you need proof, go to zophar and download my editors, Hat Trick, and Carrot. 
Now, excuse my ignorance, but what is .NET, and what does it do to make VB.NET different from VB?
.NET is a new platform from Microsoft. It's in theory and some practise platform and language independent. The languages need to follow a certain standardized template (CLI, common language interface) and provide some basic building blocks. All .NET languages can compile to .NET pseudo-code, run by the CLR, common language runtime. Another part of .NET is the .NET frameworks, providing the base classes needed. All of .NET is object-oriented, and so's VB.NET. (VB1-6 is object-based, not object-oriented.)
There are currently two known implementations of the .NET framework and runtime. The first is Microsoft's official implementation, the second is an open source effort called Mono, available for amongst others Linux-like platforms, and supported by amongst others Novell.
Parasyte: These people have a need for an IDE for the VB1-6 branch. That's because the (official) compiler only comes with Microsoft's VB IDE suite. This is .NET which can be used with a standalone compiler, yes, but they would need the IDE for the VB1-6 branch because it includes the compiler. |
Parasyte
Posts: 112/514 |
What I am saying goes right alongside what you are saying Jesper. 
The only reason I brought it up is because a few in this thread have mentioned some "NEED" for an IDE. There is absolutely no need for an IDE; you already have everything required. An IDE is just fluff.
Somehow everyone seems to be misinterpreting what I am trying to get across. Communication errors abound! |
Drag
Posts: 172/254 |
I have a retail version of VB5-Learner's Edition, and I can compile my EXEs with it. If you need proof, go to zophar and download my editors, Hat Trick, and Carrot.
Now, excuse my ignorance, but what is .NET, and what does it do to make VB.NET different from VB? |
Jesper
Posts: 537/2390 |
The compiler is already free (as in beer), so there's no discussion. Noone ever brought up or debated that the IDE was more important than the compiler. The compiler is an absolute requirement for coding unless you want to write that CLI code yourself. If you want to discuss IDEs, you're off to a wrong start by firing at the wrong target. Any IDE - any useful one - builds on top of the compiler; the opposite would not function, so thus they are orders of magnitude apart. Comparing them does not make sense nor make a good argument for what you're arguing, so stop it.
The IDE is a nice extra second step (the first step being the compiler). With the IDE lots more people will be taking their first steps in programming where they wouldn't otherwise. I started out with VB 4.0, and that worked out pretty well.  |
Parasyte
Posts: 111/514 |
I was refering to tha fact that IDEa are "pretty much useless" for compiling anything. Hence the whole thing about why a compiler is more important, in the first place. |
NightHawk
Posts: 275/621 |
Originally posted by Parasyte
No, by that logic, a compiler is far more important than an IDE. You're comparing apples and oranges, eh?
No, you specifically said an IDE is "pretty much useless". That's far different from being less important.
Also, MAKE has many uses. It's sole purpose is not to integrate with a compiler.
That's true for several IDEs I've used as well.
EDIT: I don't really want to get into an argument about this, and it's getting off-topic for this thread, so why don't we just agree to disagree about IDEs and such? |
Parasyte
Posts: 110/514 |
No, by that logic, a compiler is far more important than an IDE. You're comparing apples and oranges, eh?
Also, MAKE has many uses. It's sole purpose is not to integrate with a compiler. |
NightHawk
Posts: 271/621 |
Originally posted by Parasyte
IDE's are pretty much useless. Think of it this way; would you rather have a compiler with no IDE, or an IDE with no compiler? The obvious choice is the former. Therefore IDEs are not worth spending ANY money on.
So, by that logic, "make" is also useless.
And by the way, professional-grade IDEs come with tools and utilities that make my job as a programmer much easier. For example, dialog editors, icon editors, string table generators, etc., etc. Not having to write a .rc file myself is a HUGE benefit that saves me a lot of time, and that means I can get the interface done quicker, and then concentrate on coding. |
neotransotaku
Posts: 978/4016 |
Originally posted by Parasyte
IDE's are pretty much useless. Think of it this way; would you rather have a compiler with no IDE, or an IDE with no compiler? The obvious choice is the former. Therefore IDEs are not worth spending ANY money on.
Since when does a professional IDE come without an compiler? I think only the free ones are like that 
Anyways, Visual Basic .NET is stuck being .NET but C# nor C++ is restricted to .NET however. But making windows applications with C# would require third party GUI libraries... |
dan
Posts: 95/782 |
Originally posted by Gb boy
Originally posted by Jesper
This uses Visual Basic.NET and not Visual Basic, which means your programs will have to be partially rewritten. There's a migration wizard to try to translate your code, but it's not likely to work with your custom API calls. I don't know.
I thought you could integrate your .NET with regular VB and C++ without having it partially modified  . O well, I don't know anything about C-based languages anyway.
Visual Basic .NET is like a new language with Java leanings, compared to the original VB that is. There's a migration wizard, but you'd be better off rewriting your code to use the .net framework proper, not the compatibility classes that are used when the migration wizard does its work. |
Parasyte
Posts: 108/514 |
IDE's are pretty much useless. Think of it this way; would you rather have a compiler with no IDE, or an IDE with no compiler? The obvious choice is the former. Therefore IDEs are not worth spending ANY money on. |
NightHawk
Posts: 257/621 |
Originally posted by neotransotaku
just to be correct, you'll postpone buying an updated IDE instead of a compiler, right? because the .NET compiler is free but the IDE isn't...
Well, I hate working without an IDE these days for anything but very small and simple projects*, so yeah, I'd basically be buying it for the IDE, lol.
*: I can't remember the last time I worked on a small OR simple project, let alone one that was both small AND simple. |
neotransotaku
Posts: 970/4016 |
just to be correct, you'll postpone buying an updated IDE instead of a compiler, right? because the .NET compiler is free but the IDE isn't... |
NightHawk
Posts: 249/621 |
I've downloaded the Visual C++ Express beta, and I'm going to check that out.
If it works well enough, I'll postpone buying an updated compiler until this one's out. |
Dylan
Posts: 124/1407 |
Originally posted by Jesper
This uses Visual Basic.NET and not Visual Basic, which means your programs will have to be partially rewritten. There's a migration wizard to try to translate your code, but it's not likely to work with your custom API calls. I don't know.
I thought you could integrate your .NET with regular VB and C++ without having it partially modified . O well, I don't know anything about C-based languages anyway. |
Darth Coby
Posts: 684/1371 |
Originally posted by Jesper
The VB 5 was a trial. This is a beta. Fully featured. (What's in here will also be in the finished product)
Some things should be noted:
This uses Visual Basic.NET and not Visual Basic, which means your programs will have to be partially rewritten. There's a migration wizard to try to translate your code, but it's not likely to work with your custom API calls. I don't know.
This won't be free when it's done, but it will be cheap. I'm guessing between the price of a video game and Microsoft Word.
As with other .NET languages, people using your app will need to have the .NET Framework installed, but since this is a beta of .NET Framework 2.0 too, they'll need .NET Framework 2.0.
Oh, I won't use it then.
*Coby sticks with VB6.0 |
Jesper
Posts: 509/2390 |
The VB 5 was a trial. This is a beta. Fully featured. (What's in here will also be in the finished product)
Some things should be noted:
This uses Visual Basic.NET and not Visual Basic, which means your programs will have to be partially rewritten. There's a migration wizard to try to translate your code, but it's not likely to work with your custom API calls. I don't know.
This won't be free when it's done, but it will be cheap. I'm guessing between the price of a video game and Microsoft Word.
As with other .NET languages, people using your app will need to have the .NET Framework installed, but since this is a beta of .NET Framework 2.0 too, they'll need .NET Framework 2.0. |
Darth Coby
Posts: 679/1371 |
So, can you compile your source with this or is it just for testing? I remember there being a VB 5 or something in wich you couldn't make EXEs, just run your source code. |
RavenX
Posts: 36/57 |
I'm downloading it now, so i'll tell you all how it is ^^ |
neotransotaku
Posts: 935/4016 |
i wonder how good this version is compared to the professional grade version of the software. I guess someone will have to download this and see... any VB programmers out there? if not VB, how about C++ since there is C++ express as well...
well...the compiler was free, not the IDE...so I guess it is about time microsoft released a free IDE... |
| This is a long thread. Click here to view it. |
|
