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Main - ROM Hacking - Super Mario All-Stars NES (v10-15-17) Emulator & NES/Famicom patches New thread | New reply

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infidelity
Posted on 04-26-17 08:04 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165458


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Posted by stgiga
Also, due to lack of menu letter space, Mario Bros. had to be made into the Easter Egg it currently is.


To be technical, there were a few reasons for this decision.

1. I would've had to redo my entire vram routine, for drawing the title logos onto the screen. The original 4 games had hard coded address values to draw the tiles to. But then with Mario Bros., that pushed the number to 5 logos, and I would've had to completely redo my vram routine, so that every logo would be written to both nametables, when that time came. And I wanted none of that.

2. IF, I was to accomplish #1, then I'd be faced with a palette swap dilemma. Mario Bros. uses 3 sets of palettes for the entire logo. I would've been screwed because the game falls between Mario 3, and SMB, so the transition color-wise would not work.

So that's the reasoning for having the Mario Bros. logo drawn at the top of the name table, and semi-hidden. :-)

Ice Man
Posted on 04-26-17 08:19 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165459


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Ah, makes sense. Thanks for that info.

Da_GPer
Posted on 04-27-17 02:02 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165461


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Posted by infidelity
I'll be honest, I've never played smb2j fully on the .fds version, so I can't say what's missing, if you can provide me comparison videos, I'll take a listen.


No problem. I didnt make these videos, but they should be what your looking for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W-cW20snPg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrjFYOGfqAs

infidelity
Posted on 04-27-17 01:19 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165465


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Hmm, quite honestly I'm not feeling the drive to add those 2 small durations. I thought it was something more that was missing. On top of that, I haven't learned how to utilize the extra square channels within the mmc5, I've only worked with the raw pcm. Plus, that Famicom sound is quite unique, idk if a square channel can duplicate it. I'm more than willing to chat with someone who has experience in utilizing the square channels with the mmc5.

bnash222005
Posted on 04-27-17 03:33 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165466


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Posted by infidelity
Hmm, quite honestly I'm not feeling the drive to add those 2 small durations. I thought it was something more that was missing. On top of that, I haven't learned how to utilize the extra square channels within the mmc5, I've only worked with the raw pcm. Plus, that Famicom sound is quite unique, idk if a square channel can duplicate it. I'm more than willing to chat with someone who has experience in utilizing the square channels with the mmc5.


The ony way to know if the theme song can play with no problems is playing it on an actual cart. I have a few Super Mario Bros 2J on NES cart and I will try to play them all to see if I find any issues with the music on my Retron 3.

infidelity
Posted on 04-27-17 03:56 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165467


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Idk if the waveform data for the expanded audio is in this .fds to .nes conversion. I have the kevtris hdmi for my Nintendo, which allows playback of the expanded .fds audio. The cartridge that I had made for me long ago, I could test it out to find out if the waveform data was left intact from the conversion I've been working with.

bnash222005
Posted on 04-27-17 04:22 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165468


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Posted by infidelity
Idk if the waveform data for the expanded audio is in this .fds to .nes conversion. I have the kevtris hdmi for my Nintendo, which allows playback of the expanded .fds audio. The cartridge that I had made for me long ago, I could test it out to find out if the waveform data was left intact from the conversion I've been working with.


That would be better if you tried it since you are using the actual rom for this hack. I would advise using a game genie or cheats if possible if you are using a retron 5 to help get through the game faster because Super Mario Bros 2J can be a real pain to beat.

infidelity
Posted on 04-27-17 04:55 PM (rev. 3 of 04-27-17 11:32 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165469


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Can someone confirm if this is infact intact?

This should be evident via fceux correct?

If so, load up Mario 2J, start 1-1, open up the hex viewer, set $75C to 03 (might be $75D, this register is the vram write for the sub world number), $75F to 07, and $760 to 03, then die, then you should start at 8-4.

EDIT

OK, I did some tests, specifically with Nestopia on my laptop, since that gives you the option to mess with the volume control of the .FDS expansion audio.

I played the original .FDS version, and can clearly hear the .fds sound. Now, with FCEUX, I tried sniffing through the RAM of the .FDS file within the $C000-$DFFF section. I think that I found the wavetable that is used for the .fds expansion audio.

I looked within my All-Stars game, and the same table is there. I looked on nesdev wiki, to see what register(s) are used within the Famicom, to inititate the .FDS expansion audio. My version of SMB2J in All-Stars has that address set correctly when I boot the game.

So I used the cheat function, to hex edit the ram registers to take me directly to 8-4, instead of playing the entire game. I beat the game, and turned off all of the sound except for .fds expansion audio.

Nothing played... :-/

I may have to goto nesdev and see if anyone can help me out with it. I figured FCEUX or Nestopia would've played the .fds audio.

bnash222005
Posted on 04-27-17 11:49 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165471


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Whoa! That is crazy! I wonder if it is possible to simply use the ending song from Super Mario Bros 1? It is the same song and to be honest I really do not care to have the Super Mario Bros 2J song from the FDS as it is simply the same song. That would be the easiest fix in my honest opinion so it will play properly when put onto an NES cart and played on an actual NES system like for example the original NES system.

infidelity
Posted on 04-28-17 12:13 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165472


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I'm not changing or swapping anything anymore. The game is the way it is. If however, there is a solution to getting the .FDS wavetable to output within my .NES rom, then I will attempt that. But if this is a no-go, then this game is completely finished.

MrPete1985
Posted on 04-28-17 12:56 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165473


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Might work if you enable the channel on a HiDefNES. I have one but am pretty bad at SMB2j

infidelity
Posted on 04-28-17 01:29 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165474


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Same here. I own the KEVTRIS HiDefNES, and I enable all the of the expanded audio channels. And I am pretty bad at SMB2J as well, I don't feel like trying to tear through that game, only to find out after all of that i'm back at square 1 with the audio.

If I'm able to get the FDS audio to playback via an emulator, then Ill see if whether or not my HDMI NES will play the .FDS audio at Princess Toadstool.

Da_GPer
Posted on 04-28-17 01:51 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165475


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Another solution would be to remake the song using the same sound format that the rest of the game uses. It may not sound 100% the same, but if you recreate the same song, it should be just as good.

infidelity
Posted on 04-28-17 03:19 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165476


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idk why I need to redo the song? The song sounds just the same as it does within the .FDS version, it's just missing 1 track which is the expanded audio.

bnash222005
Posted on 04-28-17 05:10 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165477


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Use game genie to get through Super Mario Bros 2J. Make sure to turn on the fly jump code but be careful in castles because you will get stuck at the top when you make it to King Koopa. A game genie is a must to have if you have the old school games on actual carts.

Da_GPer
Posted on 04-28-17 11:04 AM (rev. 2 of 04-28-17 12:31 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165478


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Posted by infidelity
idk why I need to redo the song? The song sounds just the same as it does within the .FDS version, it's just missing 1 track which is the expanded audio.


Ah. I didnt know. I didnt beat the game on the NES yet. I have on the SNES long ago though. The game is brutally hard.


EDIT: I went and used the cheat that infidelity gave to go to 8-4 along with a few Game Genie codes for infinite time, infinite jump, and always firey and beaten 8-4. The song sounds just like Super Mario Bros 1, sound wise. I think we are fine with this and dont need to change anything.

infidelity
Posted on 04-28-17 12:52 PM (rev. 5 of 04-28-17 01:36 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165479


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Looking like a no-go. From what I was told at nesdev.


Actually, the FDS is essentially a cartridge, containing hardware enhancements just like normal cartridges.


So from what I'm getting, is that even though the sound data is present in my all-stars game, it lacks the hardware to output it. But I'm waiting on another question I had, as to how that can be with the DISK version of SMB2J, it's on a pc disk.

I'm at 5-1 now on my all-stars cartridge, but I'll still try to beat the game on my nes, just for my own personal confirmation.

stgiga
Posted on 04-28-17 06:57 PM (rev. 4 of 04-28-17 07:14 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165480


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Posted by infidelity
Looking like a no-go. From what I was told at nesdev.


Actually, the FDS is essentially a cartridge, containing hardware enhancements just like normal cartridges.


So from what I'm getting, is that even though the sound data is present in my all-stars game, it lacks the hardware to output it. But I'm waiting on another question I had, as to how that can be with the DISK version of SMB2J, it's on a pc disk.

I'm at 5-1 now on my all-stars cartridge, but I'll still try to beat the game on my nes, just for my own personal confirmation.


From what I have read about the FDS and MMC5, they both have an Extra PCM Wavetable channel as part of the sound. SMB2j uses the channel as a Square Tubular Bell, and I figured that something similar code-wise to how you did Mario 1's skid sound, Mario 2 USA's Unused sound sample, and the Mike Tyson's Punch-Out Cheering sample would be enough to make the MMC5 play the FDS audio. All that needs to be done is tell SMB2j to play the sound as if it were an MMC5 sample, instead of FDS. This would let it play on hardware, as MMC5 does not normally emulate FDS audio without ASM.

The FDS cart is practically an official PowerPak Lite, which had ram to load games onto. The Drive read the PRG and CHR from the disk, and mapped it based on size. This was fed to the Ram adapter, which read the sound and such. It will never output via the FDS channel, but if you fix it like SMB2USA, it WILL output via MMC5 as the tubular bell it should have played as. The sound should sound like a church bell to a degree, almost like a Sound Blaster 16, or a Chime. Zelda 1 on FDS did use extra samples, which Nintendo Emulated accurately on the Japanese 2004 Zelda Collectors Edition GCN disc, and made into an iNes headered rom (The same rom is in Doubutsu No Mori +, and maybe Doubutsu no Mori N64). The other info to note is that the FDS prototype did too, plus I think that the way you used FDS samples in LoL is proof that it works. SMB2u also used FDS Doki Doki Panic's death sample in the unused sample, and SMB3 used the Lost Levels Skid sound. Mario Bros. Classic used an FDS Kattekita Mario Bros. as a base, so includes the missing Arcade and JPN arcade levels and enemies similar to Pie Factory, and as such, included FDS samples ported to NROM PCM. Of course, you added the SMB2j skid sound to SMB1. Also, in this video, the ending sounds like it should, and I do hear a pleasant chime halfway in the intro.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8vuIT6QZ4Y

infidelity
Posted on 04-28-17 09:23 PM (rev. 2 of 04-28-17 09:35 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165482


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If the .fds wavetable is the same as a PCM sample, then I will convert the .fds write registers to utilize the mmc5 $5010 PCM. I borrowed the cheering DPCM from Mike tyson, and I have the mmc5 playing it during my wii shop channel song. So I'm familiar with that channel. I'm intrigued, thanks for all that information, I'll tinker around later today.

Hmm, I'm wondering, if this is the same as a dpcm sample, then why did that game need to use expanded audio? And if this really can be used as DPCM or PCM, then why hasn't other conversions utilized the APU $4010 or MMC5 $5010?

You're certain this is true, that $4010 or $5010 can read and output the expanded wavetable?

stgiga
Posted on 04-28-17 11:31 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165483


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Posted by infidelity
If the .fds wavetable is the same as a PCM sample, then I will convert the .fds write registers to utilize the mmc5 $5010 PCM. I borrowed the cheering DPCM from Mike tyson, and I have the mmc5 playing it during my wii shop channel song. So I'm familiar with that channel. I'm intrigued, thanks for all that information, I'll tinker around later today.

Hmm, I'm wondering, if this is the same as a dpcm sample, then why did that game need to use expanded audio? And if this really can be used as DPCM or PCM, then why hasn't other conversions utilized the APU $4010 or MMC5 $5010?

You're certain this is true, that $4010 or $5010 can read and output the expanded wavetable?


I do know that the FDS, according to https://wiki.nesdev.com/w/index.php/FDS_audio outputs a wavetable channel on it's own sound hardware, the 2c33 chip, which may be similar in PCM ability to the 2a03 chip in it's family. The NESDEV article mentions that the wavetable channel is a better version of the gameboy channel. On an original Gameboy Color, with sub-frame TAS, someone did a Pokemon Yellow run, which played video with even real speech through the speaker using PWM and pulsing/wave modulation on that channel in the way that the same game created Pikachu's Ikue Ohtani voice acting as the cry of your starter Pikachu. As such, I suspect that since the MMC5 is known to use Enhanced DPCM over a stock console, that if we convert the wavetable synthesis instructions used by the FDS to create a bellchime into a PCM sample, we could restore the missing chime. In it's current form, you would need to follow these instructions: http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?t=4743&p=41958.

I also found a patch for mario 1 and 2j which changes the ? blocks to the JPN 25th anniversary blocks. Seems fitting.
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Main - ROM Hacking - Super Mario All-Stars NES (v10-15-17) Emulator & NES/Famicom patches New thread | New reply

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