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Main - ROM Hacking - Mega Man 4 Voyage - Updated July 2017 New thread | New reply

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DurfarC
Posted on 05-02-17 11:33 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165525


Shyguy
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Since: 10-23-08
From: Norway

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Posted by Ness
Hey,

This hacks looks promising. Great job implementing enemies from MM5/6/9.

TBH a lot of MM romhacks are not to my liking, either they're kaizo, or random questionable stuff, but this one looks great.

Those MM5 tigers trying to jump when they have no place look a bit retarded though. Also the Mummies look out of place in that modern tech background, they're the kind of enemies which are hard to fit outside of their original level without looking 'random'.

Is that music your own as well?
Thanks for the nice words, and the input! I can agree about the tigers (which I tried to redraw to look like Lions, not sure if I was successful haha), I will see if I can adjust the roof in that room a bit. As for the Mummies, you're probably right too, though they're already located in Pharaoh Man's stage, which now has a rather updated look with tiles from MM5. They are still bricks I guess, and the level looks like a Pyramid (from the outside area, when you enter it).

Ness
Posted on 05-02-17 11:59 AM (rev. 4 of 05-02-17 12:04 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165526


Goomba
Level: 8

Posts: 15/23
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Since: 03-02-17
From: France

Last post: 16 days
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The good thing about your backgrounds is that they're animated (either pal or chr anim). Lot's of romhacks borrow backgrounds from other games, but don't bother building the animations, which make them feel stiff.

Your lion's alright. Though that made me have a look at them and even before inspecting them carefully I thought their rear paw during the idle anim looked fat. In comparison with the original tigers, the paw is taller and looks more square. It's just a couple of pixels that differ though, but with sprite editing NES games even one single pixel can make a huge difference in how one percieves the whole thing.



____________________
Mega Man V - Second Strike
http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/3343/

DurfarC
Posted on 05-02-17 07:02 PM (rev. 3 of 05-02-17 07:17 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165527


Shyguy
Level: 22

Posts: 88/93
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Since: 10-23-08
From: Norway

Last post: 39 days
Last view: 1 day
Hmmm now that you say it, I've noticed some hacks indeed missing the different palettes alternating in the background. Including those are pretty easy, so it makes me wonder why they were lazy about that, haha.

And yes, I can now see the problem with the rear paw (and actually a pixel missing on the front paw too), thanks for notifying me about that one! It was a pain to edit this thing, because the tigers consist of 5 different sprites that all have both shared tiles and some original ones. Combine this with my zero talent when it comes to visual stuff, and errors like this pop up. I will fix this one right away!

Ness
Posted on 05-02-17 07:08 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165528


Goomba
Level: 8

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Since: 03-02-17
From: France

Last post: 16 days
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I've been doing some sprite editing in MM5 lately. From what I can tell MM5 is very close to MM4. If there is free space in the CHR banks the lion uses, you should be able to change tile allocation and thus do whatever you want easily, make it so that shared tiles aren't shared anymore, etc

Though you probably know this already considering the amount of enemies you've included from other games.

____________________
Mega Man V - Second Strike
http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/3343/

DurfarC
Posted on 05-02-17 07:19 PM (rev. 2 of 05-02-17 07:20 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165529


Shyguy
Level: 22

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Since: 10-23-08
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Last post: 39 days
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Aaaand it's already done! Tiger's sprite is now correct, and I also increased the height of the room with 2 tigers and put them a bit further back, so that it doesn't look stupid but that they "will reach you" in the same amount of time. Thanks for the suggestions once again!

As for graphics loading, it's actually quite different, MM5 has an automated system which makes the graphics for each enemy load automatically, allocating the free tiles. Mega Man 4 however, doesn't, you have to manually specify what graphics should load for each room/hallway. It did get fixed nicely now though so it wasn't a problem. There are similarities as well though - so I could copy the sprite data straight out of MM5 with some editing.

Zynk
Posted on 05-03-17 09:26 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165533


Octoballoon
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Posted by DurfarC

Posted by Zynk
Would you consider having new robot masters? If they have new attack patterns, new robot masters would be great step forward for this romhack.
Unfortunately my drawing skills are terrible, and so is my imagination. Though, they will get new or at least altered attack patterns!
You could ask for help with that.

____________________

kuja killer
Posted on 05-03-17 09:31 AM (rev. 2 of 05-03-17 09:33 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 165534


Level: 49

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Since: 03-20-07
From: Lake Havasu City, Arizona

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I have absolutely poor imagination skills too. it's super hard for me to think of things to do... even just simply looking for "what" games to copy attacks and patterns from is hard.. i mean, there's millions of games, so i cant figure out what games to look at, to study and copy from heh.

I only have 5 of 8 boss's AI behavior's completed for odyssey. I'd start on Disc Man next, but i dont know what to "think"...or what games to look at.

Ness
Posted on 05-03-17 10:07 AM (rev. 3 of 05-03-17 10:14 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 165535


Goomba
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Since: 03-02-17
From: France

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Posted by DurfarC
As for graphics loading, it's actually quite different, MM5 has an automated system which makes the graphics for each enemy load automatically, allocating the free tiles. Mega Man 4 however, doesn't, you have to manually specify what graphics should load for each room/hallway. It did get fixed nicely now though so it wasn't a problem. There are similarities as well though - so I could copy the sprite data straight out of MM5 with some editing.


I'm aware of the difference between the way MM4 and MM5 handle pattern load, but I was talking about sprite pattern definitions. If two sprites share the same graphics, and as long as there is still free tiles left in the part of the CHR bank that enemy uses, you should be able to change the definition so that whatever shared tile isn't shared anymore, for instance if enemy sprite's tile 1 and 2 are shared and both use offset 30, you can probably change it so that tile 2 uses offset 31 instead, and if that one is empty, draw your stuff there.

I've been doing this a lot in MM5 lately. Though I assume this is more limited in MM4, because in MM5 things aren't loaded "automatically" but rather, instead of choosing pattern load offsets per room, you choose it per frame for each entity. This means that you can very well switch to another offset in the CHR bank for any frame if you need more space, very convenient, and I doubt that'd be possible in 4.

BTW - have you been editing sounds as well? To try and give all these enemies their original sounds? I'd be very interested if you found any interesting info about the game's sound system, since it is in the same in other MM games too. I'm aware of Matrixz's documentation on the subject, which was very helpful, but it mostly deals with musics rather than sound.
You can probably copy-paste sound definitions from other MM games, but I doubt they'd work as is since the sounds themselves will be different.

____________________
Mega Man V - Second Strike
http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/3343/

DurfarC
Posted on 05-03-17 02:19 PM (rev. 3 of 05-03-17 02:25 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 165537


Shyguy
Level: 22

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Since: 10-23-08
From: Norway

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Posted by Ness
Posted by DurfarC
As for graphics loading, it's actually quite different, MM5 has an automated system which makes the graphics for each enemy load automatically, allocating the free tiles. Mega Man 4 however, doesn't, you have to manually specify what graphics should load for each room/hallway. It did get fixed nicely now though so it wasn't a problem. There are similarities as well though - so I could copy the sprite data straight out of MM5 with some editing.


I'm aware of the difference between the way MM4 and MM5 handle pattern load, but I was talking about sprite pattern definitions. If two sprites share the same graphics, and as long as there is still free tiles left in the part of the CHR bank that enemy uses, you should be able to change the definition so that whatever shared tile isn't shared anymore, for instance if enemy sprite's tile 1 and 2 are shared and both use offset 30, you can probably change it so that tile 2 uses offset 31 instead, and if that one is empty, draw your stuff there.

I've been doing this a lot in MM5 lately. Though I assume this is more limited in MM4, because in MM5 things aren't loaded "automatically" but rather, instead of choosing pattern load offsets per room, you choose it per frame for each entity. This means that you can very well switch to another offset in the CHR bank for any frame if you need more space, very convenient, and I doubt that'd be possible in 4.

BTW - have you been editing sounds as well? To try and give all these enemies their original sounds? I'd be very interested if you found any interesting info about the game's sound system, since it is in the same in other MM games too. I'm aware of Matrixz's documentation on the subject, which was very helpful, but it mostly deals with musics rather than sound.
You can probably copy-paste sound definitions from other MM games, but I doubt they'd work as is since the sounds themselves will be different.
Yeah, I know it isn't really "automatic", but I do know how it works and it's much more convenient for sure. The thing is that the sprite load set with the tigers on is already full (every tile is used) so I can't add anything else to it. Luckily I don't really need to, either.

I have edited some sounds, though not that many. Most of them, such as the tiger's roar or the Curlinger's wall collision sound, I copied straight out of MM5 and MM6; it sounds exactly the same as long as you copy the instruments used as well or find a similar one in MM4. I do know how to make my own sounds as well, matrixz's document also deals with that, though the process is tedious and it's quite difficult to come up with ideas for how they should sound. I am going to play around some more with sounds though, as a lot of MM4 enemies don't have them, but imo should have!

Posted by kuja killer
I have absolutely poor imagination skills too. it's super hard for me to think of things to do... even just simply looking for "what" games to copy attacks and patterns from is hard.. i mean, there's millions of games, so i cant figure out what games to look at, to study and copy from heh.

I only have 5 of 8 boss's AI behavior's completed for odyssey. I'd start on Disc Man next, but i dont know what to "think"...or what games to look at.
Then we're two, haha. Though, from what I saw in MMOdyssey so far, you're doing a fine job with the enemies, bosses and everything. I still owe you a song for that hack btw, I promised so long ago, but as you know I'm super slow and my creativity stagnates all the time. When I'm done with this hack I'm not going to start my own projects anymore (there won't be time for that anymore in the long run) but instead help others with theirs, so hopefully I can do a song or two then.

Posted by Zynk
Posted by DurfarC

Posted by Zynk
Would you consider having new robot masters? If they have new attack patterns, new robot masters would be great step forward for this romhack.
Unfortunately my drawing skills are terrible, and so is my imagination. Though, they will get new or at least altered attack patterns!
You could ask for help with that.
I know, though it's going to be a lot of work anyway and I have already worked on this thing for way longer than I should, so they will just have to stick with their original names and sprites I'm afraid.

XTTX
Posted on 05-04-17 08:27 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165541


Flurry
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Since: 04-14-08
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Almost there! Looking good DufarC! I guess it will not be too much longer then?

DurfarC
Posted on 05-04-17 09:04 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165543


Shyguy
Level: 22

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Since: 10-23-08
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Posted by XTTX
Almost there! Looking good DufarC! I guess it will not be too much longer then?
Thanks! My goal is to have it finished before Christmas (but hopefully earlier), as I'm done with my studies then and will have to get a job, which means I won't have a lot of free time anymore. I guess I'm super unreliable when it comes to getting things done, but at least we're getting closer every day.

DurfarC
Posted on 07-07-17 03:11 AM (rev. 2 of 07-07-17 03:21 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 165763


Shyguy
Level: 22

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Since: 10-23-08
From: Norway

Last post: 39 days
Last view: 1 day
Small update: The hack is nearing completion and is probably being released at the end of the year, hopefully sooner. Here's the final list of everything it can offer when it's done:

- Brand new levels, with graphics imported from other NES games as well as Mega Man 9 and 10
- New enemies, mini bosses and stage gimmicks, mostly from other Mega Man games but also a few original ones
- Totally different boss AIs for the 8 robot masters, and new Skull Castle bosses (unlike the robot masters, most of these are different from vanilla MM4)
- Altered weapons and new adaptor items with new uses
- All new music composed specifically for this hack by 5 different chiptune composers. Those are: Golden Shades, RRThiel, CosmicGem, Jir-0 and myself
- A new storyline, partly with different cutscene graphics.
- Many improvements to the game engine (at least in my opinion), such as less lagging, faster screen transitions, weapon switch with the select button, the larger charge shot from Mega Man 5, more sound effects etc. (special thanks go to Puresabe for many of these improvements).

For those interested, here's also a playlist with some of the music uploaded on youtube: CLICK ME (note: I involved other composers lately as well, not just myself, so please pay attention to the uploader of each video, as that person is also the composer of that song)

And also some random screens, probably the last one before release, as I don't want to spoil everything such as new bosses etc:










Ice Man
Posted on 07-09-17 10:51 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165765


Cheep-cheep
Level: 31

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Since: 02-20-07
From: Germany

Last post: 9 days
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Looks great, sounds great (love Dust Man's new music). I want it now!

Thanatos-Zero
Posted on 07-23-17 11:30 AM Link | Quote | ID: 165784


Nipper Plant
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Since: 11-25-08
From: Germany - Rheinlandpfalz - Wittlich - Zur Phillippsburg 25

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Last view: 2 days
I can see the images. Photobucket apparently changed policies.

____________________
I was a prisoner enclosed in the void, were everything might end up just as myself.
There I was called the death in the void, but after a long sleep my drill was ready to pierce the void.
I came back... to guide those who are in doubt and to crush any corrupted mind.
"Just who in the hell do you think I am?!".

EggplantPimp
Posted on 07-23-17 04:20 PM Link | Quote | ID: 165786


Slime
Level: 39

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Since: 04-30-07
From: Boo York, Home Of The Big Pumpkin

Last post: 6 days
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Photobucket is pretty much dead, roll with Imgur when you get a chance.

____________________
- Nikki



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Main - ROM Hacking - Mega Man 4 Voyage - Updated July 2017 New thread | New reply

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