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04-19-24 02:39 AM |
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| Main - ROM Hacking - Chiko's Rom Hacks (ReReleased versions of Rockman 5DWL) | New thread | New reply |
| Is Chiko's hacks worth playing? | |
| Yes | |
| No | |
| Don't Care | |
| Multiple voting is not allowed. Changing your vote is allowed. 18 users have voted so far. | |
| Insectduel |
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 Hammer Brother Level: 68 Posts: 417/1069 EXP: 2686098 Next: 42702 Since: 02-16-08 From: Insectduel's office Last post: 1250 days Last view: 1249 days |
http://www.geocities.jp/takahidechikorin/
I got touch with Chiko's site since summer after I found Rockman 4DX, then Rockman 6th Mr X Return. Now the latest 2 releases which is Rockman Deft (Rockman 3 hack) and Rockman 2 Wed of Slasher. As usual, I played it and uses the same types over and over again. However, I have a few questions that really bother me. 1] How did Chiko able to finish his Rockman hacks with less than 1 month? 2] Where did Chiko come up with the title names? (Fabian Summers told me) 3] Why is Chiko steal graphics (Most of Kirby's) from other hacks but not his own or the original games? (Rockman 4DX and Rockman 6th Mr X Return does not use any custom graphics) I would like to get an interview with Chiko sometime. I also IRC chat with Konchuu Kettou last night after I tried these and told me. "Chiko may be an underrated remodeler but he'll do anything for people's attention. Meaning that his ASM work isn't normal as Yosaku or even Rock5easily. Some people took months or even years to finish their own projects. But still bothers me about Chiko's quick finish in his work unless he's at least 16 years old." I can't even finish my own projects and I already have my MM1 hack on Ice. So this is my question. Is Chiko's hacks worth playing? |
| Mineyl |
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 Ninji Level: 35 Posts: 34/243 EXP: 276677 Next: 3259 Since: 09-10-09 From: World 5 Last post: 4271 days Last view: 455 days |
I'm voting "yes" because even though I do agree and share your sentiments about infringement, the majority of his hacks are NOT Rockman 2 (which has been done into the dirt) and the majority are also more extensive than level design alone. I think this compared to not-completely-terrible stage edits make them worth playing...besides, they're great for anyone looking for challenge/frustration.  ____________________ Back from the beyond. |
| Insectduel |
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Hammer Brother Level: 68 Posts: 419/1069 EXP: 2686098 Next: 42702 Since: 02-16-08 From: Insectduel's office Last post: 1250 days Last view: 1249 days |
I have mail from Fabian Summers. This what he comment.
""I know you guys aren't as fast as Chiko. That's why he borrows things, while you make more original creations. Chiko's still got a lot to learn; but I think he could do something decent if he stopped using other people's work as a crutch. Speaking of which, I've played through a little of both Rockman 2: Wed of Slasher and Rockman Deft, and here are some of my first impressions. Rockman 2 WOS rips some backgrounds straight out of Rockman 3 Return, and some enemies from Rockman 2 Minimum, which I think had a larger influence on its design. Rockman Deft is actually a Rockman 3 hack, NOT Rockman 1. Although it borrows some ideas (such as "new" bosses, and even the names for some of them) straight from Myrtos' Rockman Last, it seems to be fairly original as far as level design goes. Granted, it's as exasperating as many of Chiko's other hacks, but there doesn't seem to be as much sprite overload or as many sneakily placed enemies. On the other hand, there are some other issues (there's a giant cat just past the midpoint of Blade Man's stage that has ridiculously poor hit detection, so you have to dodge and shoot like crazy to destroy it before the bouncing enemies it shoots out when the balls of yarn leave the screen rip you to shreds). I'm far more angry about what happened to Infidelity than I am about Chiko's antics. There's no excuse for that kind of thing, and it's insane that he has to take such actions to keep his family safe." I'm surprised that Fabian saw some things for Rockman Deft and I kinda thought Rockman Deft is for Rockman 1 which Chiko also needs to know what game it applies. |
| Dr. Hell |
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 Lakitu Level: 52 Posts: 514/552 EXP: 1025878 Next: 57962 Since: 03-02-07 From: Pittsburgh, PA Last post: 5026 days Last view: 4983 days |
Someone ripping off of other Rom Hackers?
My question is, so what? This kind of discussion comes up every once and a while in different forms. Normally though it's the question of modifying someone else's hack, hacking a hack is another way of saying it. I mean when you get right down to it, it's not like you can ever claim anything in a rom hack is your intellectual property, because you're stealing the original's IP to begin with. I mean it would be one thing to just take someone's hack and slap your name on it instead, but I can't really see anything crazy wrong with using elements from other hacks. I mean Insectduel even said in one of his posts that he used elements from another hack that were originally elements from Kirby games. So I mean I can't seem to find the disconnect where using graphics from another hack is bad, but using graphics from another official game is okay. It sort of needs to be able to go both ways. |
| amarcum81 |
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 Rope Level: 25 Posts: 25/110 EXP: 84473 Next: 5147 Since: 08-14-09 From: Cincinnati, OH Last post: 3285 days Last view: 2061 days |
Posted by Dr. Hell You just said everything I was going to say. If I take SMB GFX and slap them in a Mega Man game, then shouldn't I be accused of "stealing"? I mean when it comes right down to it... we are ALL guilty of this. I don't see what the fuss is all about personally. As long as enjoyment is gained from playing, that's what really matters in the end. And hell, look at all the Megaman 2 hacks out there already... it's been done over and over and over again! Like Dr. Hell just said in his post, it should go both ways. |
| Keiya633 |
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 Rat Level: 23 Posts: 36/91 EXP: 63432 Next: 4291 Since: 09-05-09 From: 北中城村、 沖縄 日本 Last post: 5001 days Last view: 5000 days |
My stance on Chiko's "syndrome" --as I'll call it-- while unprofessional, what peeves me is his unwillingness to change. He continues to release mediocre hacks that carry the same flaws and is refusing to polish his work at all. Bad screen transitions, blah backgrounds, inserting way too many enemies in and overall using cheap tricks to increase the difficulty of the game. That's my main gripe with what he's doing and having released six hacks that follow these trends, it's unlikely his stubbornness will let him advance his skills.
While it does bother me a tad that he's "openly plagiarizing" from other ROM hackers, he's fully entitled to do so. All of us are equally just as guilty for using material from other games, so it isn't fair and just to deem, say, TAR the official user of Gordos for spikes. It's obvious he's copying from other games, but when you think about it, so are we. We're not even supposed to tamper with ROMs, let alone possess them unless we own the game ourselves. I agree, he's putting himself in a bad light by doing this, but legally, we are in no place to ridicule him. |
| Insectduel |
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Hammer Brother Level: 68 Posts: 421/1069 EXP: 2686098 Next: 42702 Since: 02-16-08 From: Insectduel's office Last post: 1250 days Last view: 1249 days |
熱いリンクのためにありがとうございます、このサイト2ch。 感謝。 全世界は、チコがどんな詐欺であるかを知る必要があります。 そして、#534、を掲示するために、ロックマンDeftとロックマン2 Wed of Slasherの両方を演じたとき、私は同じくらいむしゃくしゃとしています。 私が好きであるチコの唯一のものがロックマン4DXです、そして、それはそれです。 口の動きで伝えられて、冒涜か悪い状態で使用してすみません、作者にもかかわらず、私は怒っています。 
私の日本語が貧しく、私の母国語でなければすみません。 Now on with it. When I first played Rockman 5 Dark Return, I thought Tar made it as a secret hack and so it qzecwx who also thought the hack is made by Tar. But Tar uses the Gordo spikes directly from the Kirby games which is OK to use in the hacks. Using the Gordo Spikes and tons of graphics from other hacks and not the originals will completely savotage the original authors who made it. If you played Rockman Deft for Magnet Man stage. The airship graphics are actually ripped from Super Mario Bros. 3, not Rockman 5WDS. I have evidence of screenshots which Chiko steals custom made or drawn graphics that are NOT from the originals. Gordo spikes are not custom made, they are ripped directly from Kirby. I can't barely tell if Dood in Gate from Sparking to Hero level designs are either custom made or ripped directly from the original. Feel free to download or reupload my screenshots. 
Also Wily 2 from Dustman's level from STH. 
There are other GFX ripped from Rockman 2 Minimum as well but can't find any graphics that were custom drawned. All I see is some Mario graphics and some of kirby's which ripped from the original game itself. Also note that Chiko uses too many cheap shot level designs for most of them (Especially Dark Return) and completely unfair play. And I have no idea where Chiko ripped off assembly (ASM) but his ASM work isn't creative either. It's just a modifed code. And finally for Rockman Deft, I can see that you stole the boss names from Rockman L but did you have to drew the sprites THAT UGLY. This is why I cannot stand Chiko's projects. All Chiko does is waste other people's time and make other people like me are unmotivated or feel bad to continue with their own projects. I already have my Mega Man 1 hack on Ice because of my activity actions from March 2008 to June 2009 (Or August 2009's release). I hope nothing happens with MegaGirl or I'll cancel it. ~ Insectduel |
| Dr. Hell |
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Lakitu Level: 52 Posts: 518/552 EXP: 1025878 Next: 57962 Since: 03-02-07 From: Pittsburgh, PA Last post: 5026 days Last view: 4983 days |
Posted by Insectduel Um.. wat? Posted by Insectduel Since when was there a moral compass as to what is and is not okay to use in a rom hack? Posted by Insectduel How is that even anywhere near sabotage? Their names aren't on these shitty hacks are they? The only thing you can possibly be referring to is the public image of the hackers that are getting "ripped off". If they're only in it for their "public image" then that's bullshit, not to mention one of your gripes with this guy. Furthermore are we ourselves not "sabotaging" real game companies (Capcom in this case)? Posted by Insectduel So a large majority of the sprites that are in these hacks aren't considered "stolen" because they were in the original game? Nuh-uh, it doesn't work like that. Rom hackers aren't the only ones that put a lot of hard work into the original games. Posted by Insectduel No thanks. Posted by Insectduel First real gripe in this thread. Posted by Insectduel More than most people are able to do. At least he had the ability to find the modified code and find the proper place to insert it. Posted by Insectduel I bet he's so sorry that his work doesn't live up to your standards. Posted by Insectduel No, you make yourself unmotivated. If someone was ripping off my stuff (and I mean my own, not even someone else's work) I wouldn't stop being motivated, because doing this is fun to me. That's a piss poor excuse for not being motivated. Posted by Insectduel Doubtful. Oh and again, how can anyone even begin to care about this? |
| Keiya633 |
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Rat Level: 23 Posts: 37/91 EXP: 63432 Next: 4291 Since: 09-05-09 From: 北中城村、 沖縄 日本 Last post: 5001 days Last view: 5000 days |
Wah, you beat me again, Dr. Hell. D:
Well, no use reiterating what you're going to say, so I'll leave that alone. Insectduel, before I begin, let me just say I looked up to you as a hacker, hoping I'd one day learn as much as you. But after seeing this thread, I don't know... Posted by Insectduel Let's pretend I'm completely uneducated. What does this have to do with ANYTHING you're working on? "Unmotivated? Feel bad?" How is Chiko to blame for this at all? I'll tell you the answer: He's not. You are. What you're doing is using a crappy cover up to conceal your own laziness. If this truly has an impact on your progression for your ROM hack, you must have mental problems or something, or have such low self-esteem that you need to see a shrink. It's not a big deal at all, and if you're worried about him "copying" you work, then for crying out loud, quit talking about Mega Girl. The more you mouth about it or reveal content, however much of your work was publicized, the higher probability he'll steal from that too. "Oh look, Insectduel's coming out with Mega Girl. It was released so quickly, so I'm just going to give up on my hack and blame Insectduel for my lack of motivation." - Think that would be fair to you? That's exactly what you're doing. Plus, you admitted yourself that you had "activites from March 2008 to June 2009." What, did Chiko give you a list of things to do during this time that prevented you from working on your hack? I don't think so. You're being a drama queen about this, and no one's liking it so for your own reputation, please, knock it off. Work on your own hack and don't worry about Chiko. We understand if you're going to take a break from it, but don't push the blame on other people. If you do this, people will be more supportive of you. I apologize if this sounds abrasive, but I needed to say something. I was getting tired of seeing these incoherent complaints. |
| amarcum81 |
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Rope Level: 25 Posts: 26/110 EXP: 84473 Next: 5147 Since: 08-14-09 From: Cincinnati, OH Last post: 3285 days Last view: 2061 days |
Wow! I'm really amazed at all the crap that has gone down on board 2 as of the past few days. It seems everyone has forgot why we're all here... to learn about ROM hacking and enjoy each other's hacks. Insectduel... I have much respect for you as a hacker... but wouldn't it make more sence to spend more time on your own hacks rather then complaining about what another hacker is doing? Personally, if someone ripped GFX from one of my hacks, (IF I HAD ANY COMPLETED) I'd be kind of happy about it. Knowing that they liked it enough to use it would be kind of a compliment. After all, were all pretty much "stealing" when we use graphics from one game and put them into another. In other words, if I was to get "ripped off" it wouldn't bother me, and you shouldn't let it bother you.
My point is, I don't see Chiko causing any of us ROM hackers any harm. His hacks wont cause me to stop working on my Protoman game, so why should it keep you from completing Megagirl? EDIT: I just played the Chiko hacks mentioned above. These hacks are VERY sloppy and seem to be just thrown together. Rockman Deft? WTF? The boss sprites just look rediculous! Not trying to sound mean here... but I find it hard to believe your so worked up over these hacks! Rockman WED OF SLASHER actually has the potintial to be a decent hack. Aside from the title screen being messed up, and some enemy placement issues, it's better constructed then Rockman Deft. I wont bother playing the others, as I have no intrest after playing the two I just mentioned, but I really think you should stop making a BIG deal out of Chiko's ROM hacks. At least the guy is trying, and so what if he ripped GFX from other hacks. It's what you do with those GFX that are important, and personally, I didn't see anything really impressive here. Sorry for the long post, but this thread seems pointless. Concentrate on YOUR hacks, and forget about Chiko. |
| Mineyl |
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Ninji Level: 35 Posts: 41/243 EXP: 276677 Next: 3259 Since: 09-10-09 From: World 5 Last post: 4271 days Last view: 455 days |
Chiko's already developed a reputation as a rip-off artist, and the ROM hacking community is probably small enough that if he ever ripped off your own original work, it wouldn't go unnoticed for long (source: this thread). People would identify who had the originals and probably either be indifferent to him or hate him for it.
If you're feeling anxious about him ripping you off, just remember that this is a very good reason to be a well-rounded hacker; that is, if you put your hack out first AND it is a quality project, then more people will know how much work you put into yours and in the event that it's stolen from, the community may look down upon the thief because they will already be familiar with your superior work. Let's remember that there's nothing positive that puts Chiko's hacks on a level above other people's; his level design is straightforward and mediocre, he rips off graphics (and not very well, either), his custom music isn't all that great (Dood in Gate was good, though), and his sprite AI hacking is lackluster at best and generally cheap. tl;dr: there's nothing to worry about, really. Thieves will be thieves, and if Chiko keeps riding on the coattails of other ROM hackers, his projects will never be as great as they could be. Did that make any sense? I've got such a headache right now. ____________________ Back from the beyond. |
| Mnoel02 |
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 Micro-Goomba Level: 11 Posts: 5/17 EXP: 5147 Next: 838 Since: 07-13-09 Last post: 2165 days Last view: 2165 days |
What the problem here and I think some here are acting like kids and I think to act like good people and not hate somebody ok |
| Googie |
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 Giant Red Paratroopa Level: 77 Posts: 552/1407 EXP: 4178650 Next: 12479 Since: 02-19-07 From: Brooklyn, NY Last post: 1 day Last view: 1 day |
Posted by Dr. Hell That's what came to my mind also, people keeps forgetting that this is a hobby & not a career. So what if graphics are ripped and such, as long as we have a hack/mod that we can enjoy. Well, I just hadda add my $2... Can someone please direct link or upload the patches here? That website is an infinite loop for me, thanks...  ____________________ My Linktree |
| Insectduel |
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Hammer Brother Level: 68 Posts: 427/1069 EXP: 2686098 Next: 42702 Since: 02-16-08 From: Insectduel's office Last post: 1250 days Last view: 1249 days |
Posted by Googie I never have problems for me. I can send them all by E-mail like I did with fabian summers. Some hacks like Rockman 2URA or Rockman 2 SP can't be downloaded in Taiwan. Yeah, it's kinda like SMAS gfx in SMW all over again. I do enjoy Rockman 5 Dood in Gate mostly. |
| Kiokuffiib11 |
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 Porcupo Level: 40 Posts: 63/313 EXP: 406780 Next: 34529 Since: 07-10-09 From: Marquette, Michigan Last post: 3305 days Last view: 1927 days |
I really don't see why everyone is getting sou upset.
Yeah, I understand you guys worked hard on these hacks, but honestly, the work is pubic domain. You can't register it because it's a rom hack. The rights for the rom is owned by Nintendo. People gather things from other people's roms and stick them in theirs. I think mayhaps Chiko should give credit where credit is due, yes, but, honestly, you should feel honoured that someone thinks your art is good enough to work off of. People throughout history have copied other's work, aspiring to their styles. If you go to Deviantart.com for example, you can do a search and find ALL types of art and people trying to copy a style as well, when you search anything. I'm not saying stealing work and calling it your own is the best thing to do, but, I feel it shouldn't call for this amount of hate or anger toward him, much less a whole thread written to trash his work. I personally think you should personally strive for your best, and use your own work, but that's just my style. I'm not trying to upset anyone, but, I wanted to post my point of view. ____________________ セシル |
| Megaman-Omega |
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Micro-Goomba Level: 11 Posts: 12/17 EXP: 5537 Next: 448 Since: 03-19-07 From: NY Last post: 4922 days Last view: 3888 days |
Well at this point I think it seems to be just how far you can push the envelope until someone gets pissed. I will say that while yes it is obvious when placed next to each other like that yeah he did copy and past someone elses graphics and while he should have done the work himself it's really not doing much if he just cherry picks like that
Now I'm not saying he's in the right I still disagree with him but let me put this into perspective as to what he could be doing If say hypothetically after me and Kuja's hack is done I see a hack by Chiko and I spot a few area's that have the same graphics I have. Ok fine have it a few tiles here and there aren't something to complain about Now if say I play through and he went and copied over one of the bosses. Say Duplexman...Then I'd be more than a little pissed at him I guess what I'm trying to say is that looking at everything in general his hacks really aren't as bad as they could be nor is he blatantly stealing what would really rile people up. And in a large comparison to Megaman hacks in general his end result's aren't really that that bad in the long run anyways. Not the best no but certainly not the worst |
| Googie |
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Giant Red Paratroopa Level: 77 Posts: 553/1407 EXP: 4178650 Next: 12479 Since: 02-19-07 From: Brooklyn, NY Last post: 1 day Last view: 1 day |
Posted by Insectduel Yeah if you can do that for me that'll be cool. ____________________ My Linktree |
| mickevincent |
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 Leever Level: 32 Posts: 34/193 EXP: 205883 Next: 559 Since: 02-26-08 Last post: 3350 days Last view: 963 days |
this is old and all. just wanted to say that i saw in one of his hacks(and i think it was gyro mans level) it looked like he had used my tileset from ring man stage in maverick revenge(and very badly). not that it realy matters, since i to stole them from some games and just modified them. just wanted to point it out. outpounted it is. |
| Insectduel |
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Hammer Brother Level: 68 Posts: 466/1069 EXP: 2686098 Next: 42702 Since: 02-16-08 From: Insectduel's office Last post: 1250 days Last view: 1249 days |
Posted by mickevincent I never noticed it. And parts of Blues 4 also in the boss room. I rather not try to focus on that topic because I see large numbers that people didn't care. Anyway, I wrote an article on Dood in Gate VS. Dood in Wily's Last with the changes if you're interested. Article Mine is better than datacrystal. I haven't touched Datacrystal or login into that account in months. I'm starting to do the 11/23/09 version of Dood in Wily's Last. |
| Thanatos-Zero |
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 Nipper Plant Level: 45 Posts: 114/423 EXP: 652418 Next: 7746 Since: 11-25-08 From: Germany - Rheinlandpfalz - Wittlich - Zur Phillippsburg 25 Last post: 1083 days Last view: 1046 days |
Chiko, seems to be skilled in what he/she does. However if he/she really has the skill of our top hackers, Chiko could do the same. However for me, it would be very interresting what he could create with the programmed ASM of Infidelity, Puresabre, Matrixz and Kujakiller.
Arttheft is still bad though. ____________________ I was a prisoner enclosed in the void, were everything might end up just as myself. There I was called the death in the void, but after a long sleep my drill was ready to pierce the void. I came back... to guide those who are in doubt and to crush any corrupted mind. "Just who in the hell do you think I am?!". |
| Main - ROM Hacking - Chiko's Rom Hacks (ReReleased versions of Rockman 5DWL) | New thread | New reply |
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