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Main - ROM Hacking - SMB3 Workshop Problem New thread | New reply

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Really Snooky
Posted on 02-25-09 05:27 AM Link | Quote | ID: 101804


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I deleted every single objects and sprites in a level, and then it only allows me to add 1 Three-byte objects, 1 Four-Byte objects, and can't add any sprites at all. What's the problem?

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Quick Curly
Posted on 02-25-09 01:56 PM (rev. 2 of 02-25-09 01:58 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 101818


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When you deleted all of the objects and sprites in the level, did you delete each one individually or did you delete all of them by going under the Object menu and using the "Delete All" option for each case? Also under the Edit menu, make sure that you have Freeform Mode (allows adding and deleting objects) checked and Limit Size (limit data size to avoid overwriting next levels) unchecked. With these settings, you should be able to add objects and enemies fine unless you have something else set differently that I am missing. The only reason I think this might be a possible reason is because whenever you use "Delete All" to take everything out, the totals for the objects and enemies stay the same until you add a new object or enemy. However, if you have Limit Size checked, you would probably be restricted from doing this, and therefore the totals would not be able to reset because you would not be able to add a new object or enemy.

ACTUALLY... I just tested it out and it still worked for me, even though I had Limit Size checked. I tried to uncheck Freeform Mode though and I was unable to add any objects or enemies. I'm not really sure what the problem could possibly be since I never had this problem. If anything, I can only recommend that you make sure that Freeform Mode is checked.

Maybe a screenshot could help?

KP9000
Posted on 02-25-09 04:41 PM Link | Quote | ID: 101825


Boomboom

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Well, since this thread is here, I figure I'd ask a few questions myself.

I kinda figured out how to configure my pointers to go where I want them in my level, but there are some things I don't understand yet.

1) When I click on "Edit Pointers" it gives me information on the pointer, but how do I know what level it actually points to?

2) Sometimes when I edit a pointer, the pipe that you can enter disappears and seems like it turns into a pointer. It may just delete the pipe and add a pointer?

Anyway, I don't know what's going on here, I've been able to go through my level including the bonus area before. I have changed the pointers of both sides and with a little bit of trial and error got it to work. As I progressed with making my level though, somehow the bonus area got corrupted (a lot of the level was still recognizable) and the header was also changed.

I just checked, "Limit Size" was unchecked, so it may have overwritten some of the level; though I don't think that the bonus area's data comes right after my main level... In fact, when I fixed my bonus area back to the way it should be, my main level stayed the same... That suggests that the levels' data is not close to each other...

Any ideas on what's going on here?

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Quick Curly
Posted on 02-25-09 06:12 PM (rev. 3 of 02-25-09 06:21 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 101829


Giant Red Paratroopa
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You can view/edit which level the pointers in the level you are currently editing point to by going into the Level Header Editor and clicking the "Next area/Start" tab. Here you can put in the Object Data, Enemy Data, and Object Set for the desired location for the level you are currently editing.



Here's a document I did near the end of August 2008 that basically displays the Object Data, Enemy Data, Object Set, number of objects, and number of enemies for every level, as well as a "quick" (good enough) explanation about editing the level pointers.

SMB3 Level and Pointer Data

I haven't updated that document since I released it though, so if you still have any questions if you choose to check that out, I'll try my best to help you out.

Similar to Really Snooky's problem with not being able to add objects or enemies, I haven't heard of pipes automatically turning into pointers before. I will point out what was pointed out before in regards to SMB3 pointer questions though and that's that you make sure that you are using the 90-9F 3-byte downward pipe object that you can go down and not the B0-BF 3-byte downward pipe object that you can go down that ignores pointers.

If the pipe "turns into a pointer", since pipes and pointers are both 3-byte objects, couldn't you just change the one pointer back into a pipe?

That's how I design my levels too - with Limit Size under the Edit menu unchecked. In the bottom-right hand corner when you don't have any objects or enemies selected, the "Object byte data/level size" is displayed. As a quick example, say you want to edit level 1-1 (3-byte: 81, 4-byte: 5; total: 263 -> (81*3) + (4*5) = 243 + 20 = 263) but you need to use more 4-byte objects than 3-byte objects. You could put 77 3-byte objects (231 bytes) and 8 4-byte objects (32 bytes) and that would come to a total of 263 bytes as well, so you are not overwriting another level's data.

If you download the document as a reference, it's easier to avoid exceeding the object data and enemy data limits.

On a similar note, I was actually working on a document that organized all of the object data and enemy data as it is actually organized in the SMB3 ROM. I'm at school right now so I still need to go home, but once I do I'll finish off the last little bit of it and if you want, I can PM you an advanced copy. It would really only be useful in the case that you want to expand a certain level and you would have to overwrite another level's data in order to do so, as with it you would easily be able to find out which level(s) you would be overwriting.

I was also thinking about it the other day, and if enough SMB3 hacking is going on and there are more questions or potential data sharing, maybe there could be a single topic used specifically for SMB3 stuff - sort of like on the old ACMLM (which I was unfortunately not around for ). It's just an idea though.

Anyway, I got to go to do that then. Hopefully this post is useful in some way to you, and I'll check back in with you later.

KP9000
Posted on 02-26-09 04:11 AM Link | Quote | ID: 101860


Boomboom

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Well, I got all my pointer issues fixed, so things are good to go. I had to move some items that were out of bounds of the level area, making it crash. I still don't know how that level was corrupted. Anyhow, things are going well. Thanks for the help!

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Quick Curly
Posted on 02-26-09 04:27 AM (rev. 2 of 02-26-09 11:21 PM) Link | Quote | ID: 101862


Giant Red Paratroopa
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That's good to hear. You're welcome. Yeah - make sure to avoid crash objects as well. Do you think maybe a screenshot could help? I'm curious about why it is corrupted as well.

Also, in case anyone is interested, I completed the "SMB3 Data Order" document. If you want a copy, you can download it here:

SMB3 Data Order

In this document, I've organized the enemy data in the first section, and then the object data in the second section. Do you think maybe preceding and/or succeeding levels could be causing the corruption? However, it is unlikely if you've only edited 1-1 so far though. Either way, please keep me up to date on your progress with your SMB3 hack, and best of luck with it!

As for SMB3 music, I have been thinking about doing a document for that as well, but I haven't had enough time to really go through the notes that I've documented and organize them well enough. We'll have to wait and see how that goes.

EDIT: Updated the link.

KP9000
Posted on 02-26-09 04:37 AM Link | Quote | ID: 101866


Boomboom

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Posted by Quick Curly
Do you think maybe a screenshot could help? I'm curious about why it is corrupted as well.
I don't know what caused the corruption. I fixed it already by looking at the header for the level in a clean ROM and just pasting the obvious stuff.
Posted by Quick Curly
Either way, please keep me up to date on your progress with your SMB3 hack, and best of luck with it!
Thanks. Things will go smoother, I assume. I've gone through some learning experiences with my first level and I'll know what to do with problems like these should they arise again. As far as progress goes, check out the Screenshots Thread for my YouTube video of my level.

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Quick Curly
Posted on 02-26-09 04:42 AM Link | Quote | ID: 101868


Giant Red Paratroopa
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Oh, I see. So you already fixed it. I'm sorry I misunderstood.
I already watched the video once you posted it. Your level is awesome. I can't wait to see more!

KP9000
Posted on 02-26-09 08:44 PM Link | Quote | ID: 101880


Boomboom

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Well, the hilly levels seem to be a pain in my ass, so I skipped that one for now and went on to the next. The level itself is going fine, but I've run into another problem; changing the bonus area's Graphic Set. Right now, it's set to "cloud" but I want to make it a "fortress" type. Inside the level that leads to the bonus area, I can change its header (in the pointer field) to load up a fortress set... Problem is, I can't click on "Go to next area pointed in level" button. Why does this change? Also, when I try to load up the L3 Bonus Area straight from the editor, (and this happens with a clean rom too) it loads up a different semi-corrupted level. Any ideas?

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Quick Curly
Posted on 02-27-09 12:51 AM (rev. 2 of 02-27-09 02:49 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 101893


Giant Red Paratroopa
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After I looked into it, I saw something that I never took note of before. The 1-3 header is pointing to a different offset than the Level/Offset Selector.

As seen in the first image, the 1-3 header is pointing to offset 2749A.



However, the Level/Offset Selector says that the Level 3 Bonus Area is at offset 27A3A.



If you click the "Go to next area pointed from level" button, you go from 1-3 to the Bonus Area. You can also click the button again to return to 1-3 from the Bonus Area. The level offset is rightfully 2749A.



However, if you open up the Level/Offset Selector while you're at the Level 3 Bonus Area, it will say that you're at the Level 3 Bonus Area, only at offset 27A3A.



However, if you use the Level/Offset Selector to go right to the Level 3 Bonus Area, as you've already pointed out, you get a level that looks like this:



This level's offset is 27A3A, and the enemy offset is CFE2. I never included 2749A in either of my documents because I never actually took note that it was being used before. I'm not sure if it has anything to do with it, but could that Weird 3-byte object (X:017 Y:000; Type: 47 (2F)) somehow redirect the pointer from 27A3A to 2749A? In both cases, CFE2 is being used for the enemy data, so it has something to do with the objects.

The only other possibility is that maybe the Level/Offset Selector is set wrong for the Level 3 Bonus Area in SMB3 Workshop. I tried these tests in both the 2006-06-20 version and the 2007-11-14 version and they had similar results.

So as for the solution... take your pick? Heh...

As for changing Graphic Sets for levels, I've tried it before and it didn't work out so well. I just did a quick test by changing 1-4 from Sky to Plains, editing the Graphic Set in the header, making it load as Plains, and making the 1-1 header point to it and read it as a Plains-based level. It caused a CPU jam. It might be possible to get around this, but I always figured it would be more trouble than it's worth. They're set in ranges, so they probably shouldn't be mixed anyway.

My suggestion if you want 1-3 to point to a Fortress-based area is to do just that and point to a Fortress-based area that already exists. Make sure you set the header information accordingly though. I would also suggest that if the 1-3 Bonus Area is really causing a lot of problems, you should just forget about editing it and connect 1-3 to a different area.

KP9000
Posted on 02-28-09 08:26 PM Link | Quote | ID: 101956


Boomboom

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I have been doing fine so far, just pointed somewhere else for that part of the level. Thing is, on the world map, level 4 is exactly the same as level 3. I beat level 3 and then went on to level 4, entered it, and it was the same level! I looked at the pointer, and it appears to be normal.

I don't get what the hell is going on here...

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Quick Curly
Posted on 03-03-09 12:19 AM Link | Quote | ID: 102058


Giant Red Paratroopa
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I apologize about my late reply, KP. I was a little busy over the weekend and today was my long day at school.

I'm glad to hear 1-3 worked out for you. Just an interesting note - I happened to take a look at the source code for Mario Improvement during the break before my last class and I noticed that the offset for the 1-3 Bonus Area was 0x27A43 (0x27A3A excluding the header). I'm even more curious about this now...

Anyway, the same thing happened to me at least once. All I did to fix it was close the program down, open it up again, and edit the map pointer again.

Here's a quick example that may or may not have anything to do with the map pointer messing up for you (it's one situation but there are others as well). Say you have SMB3 Workshop and the SMB3 Map Editor open at the same time and you're editing the same SMB3 ROM in both programs. Let's say you make a really cool map and save it in the SMB3 Map Editor. After that, you go in SMB3 Workshop and make a new level and save it. You run your emulator, open up the ROM, and start the game. Within a few seconds, you scream because the really cool map that you just made is gone and the old map is back! NO! WHY?!!!

The answer to this is simple. You never re-opened the SMB3 ROM in SMB3 Workshop to refresh the changes that you made first in the SMB3 Map Editor. When you made the level and saved your changes in SMB3 Workshop, you were saving to the ROM the way it was before you made and saved your really cool map.

By the way you've described your scenario though (you looked at the pointer and it appeared to be normal) maybe your SMB3 ROM just goofed on you for no logical reason at all. I know that this has happened to me as well. With one of the final Zones for Quick Bros. 2, if you died in the Zone, you would be thrown across the Map, return to your last saved spot, and then you'd be stuck. However, I redid the Zone from scratch, retested it and it worked fine. It could be one of those strange things that just can't be explained.

Hopefully within the time you posted and it took me to respond, you were able to fix the problem.

KP9000
Posted on 03-03-09 01:55 AM (rev. 2 of 03-03-09 02:08 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 102059


Boomboom

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Actually, not really. I have no idea how this came about since I never really made any changes to the map except for switching level 2 and the hidden start level's pointers. I also took note of the minor user error (double overwrite) you spoke of to make sure this didn't happen.

I'm going to take a look at the pointer in SMB3 Discombobulator since I can't figure out how to edit map pointers/tiles in SMB3W. Seems it doesn't have this feature.

Also, SMB3W is pissing me off with its instability...


EDIT:


Apparently, Level 4's pointer is loading from $23511. Level 3's pointer loads from $1EE19. Two different editors are showing this. They should be different, right? I enter the level in both editors and it loads up level 4 like it should, but when I play the ROM and go to level 4, it loads up level 3 instead!

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Quick Curly
Posted on 03-03-09 03:29 AM Link | Quote | ID: 102062


Giant Red Paratroopa
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The best program for editing the World Maps is the SMB3 Map Editor by beneficii. If you don't already have it, you can download it here:

SMB3 Map Editor

With this one program, you can do pretty much anything that you need to do when it comes to editing the World Maps.

Why is SMB3 Workshop causing problems? Is it the issues with the pointers or something else?

If those are the pointers for 1-3 and 1-4, they should be working because those are the correct offsets. If you were using the map editor in SMB3 Workshop, I recommend trying to edit the pointers with the SMB3 Map Editor instead. It takes a little playing around with to figure the program out, but once you learn how to use it, you should have no problems editing the World Maps.

KP9000
Posted on 03-03-09 06:13 PM Link | Quote | ID: 102077


Boomboom

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Still no luck. This is bizarre. I don't know if the two level pointers are pointing to the same spot for level data, or if the pointers are correct and are just loading a copy of level 3's data from level 4.

I need someone to check this out. I've never seen something like this before.

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Quick Curly
Posted on 03-03-09 07:19 PM Link | Quote | ID: 102083


Giant Red Paratroopa
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I'm more than willing to check it out for you; it's up to you how you want me to help. Perhaps a screenshot or group of screenshots to provide a visual of the problem could help; or if you wanted, you could even send me an IPS patch of your hack so that I could see the pointers for myself and see if I could fix them for you. I understand if you don't want to share an incomplete version of your hack though, but just know that you can trust me. If anything, in my opinion, that should really be your last resort, if it should be a course of action at all. Any screenshots might help provide me (and anyone else willing to help) with more insight to the problem.

If worse comes to worse, feel free to PM me and we can work something out.

As always, best of luck.

KP9000
Posted on 03-09-09 04:24 AM (rev. 4 of 03-09-09 07:37 AM) Link | Quote | ID: 102389


Boomboom

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I want to thank you for your help thus far, but I wanted to ask another thing: How do you change where (overworld map) pipes lead to? I changed the pipe tiles' positions, gave them graphical pipe tiles, and gave them pointers on the overworld. (I just took 2 hammer brother pointers and pointed them at world 2's pipe levels). After I enter the first pipe, it spits me out on a spot on the map. If I try to go back through the pipe, same thing, just different spot. I am having to deal with a rendering/scrolling issue where if you are on a map with only 1 screen and you take a pipe to the other side of the world, you come out and the whole world is shifted by half a screen. You have to go back left and it scrolls back (Like it does on larger overworlds) to where the world should be.

Any ideas? Should I post screenshots?
EDIT: Edited post to be more clear...
EDIT2: I figured it out. Disregard...

I'll probably have some more issues pretty soon. Just you wait...

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DanteRules
Posted on 04-09-09 06:01 AM Link | Quote | ID: 104824

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Sounds like you figured it out. Just in case anyone else was wondering, it's the Y-position of the enemy byte in the pipe level that determines where you will come out.

Quick Curly
Posted on 04-10-09 12:31 AM Link | Quote | ID: 104856


Giant Red Paratroopa
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DanteRules buddy! You joined Board 2! Welcome! Thanks for reviving this topic too - exactly one month later (aside from the time )!

I'm actually surprised (and of course excited) about all of the SMB3 hacking currently going on. Just a day ago, I found new videos on YouTube of new SMB3 hack previews. I think we do need a single active topic because of that as well (like this one).

I'm also curious about how KP is doing with his SMB3 hack.

Long live the SMB3 hacking era!

KP9000
Posted on 04-15-09 12:29 AM Link | Quote | ID: 105065


Boomboom

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I've pretty much worked out the kinks with this program. It's just the beginner's learning curve I had to get past. I'm sure there are more in the future I'll run into, but I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

As far as progress goes, I'm going to set aside some time in the near future to work on it some more. I've recently got into the Wii modding scene, so my motivation right now is to get it finished so I can see my hack as a channel on the Wii. Yay!

I will be sure to post in here if I need any help. I was thinking of turning the issues brought up in here into a learning experience and make a couple of guides out of it!

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