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| Acmlm's Board - I3 Archive - World Affairs/Debate - Prejudice against the Obese |
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Cruel Justice I have better things to do.                   Since: 11-18-05 From: At my house! Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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| No one can honestly blame the obese because some people are simply born that way. Why should obesity matter so much to the non-obese people anyways? There are good things that can result from a high-consumption of sweets. It's good for the economy; more money for the snack companies.
It's their choice to eat alot or lose weight, just leave them alone. If they need a trainer to keep them from gaining pounds, so be it. America shouldn't worry about how "good" they look with regards to the chubby people, the nation's already been judged and making everyone lose weight will most likely have no effect on the image that has already been set. |
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||bass Administrator   Since: 11-17-05 From: Salem, Connecticut Last post: 6280 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by [GGSA-freaken-men. Most people who bitch and complain about companies like McDonald's have absolutely no concept (even remotely) of how much taxes those companies end up paying. |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6356 days Last view: 6299 days |
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Originally posted by [GGS Yes... yes they can. When deciding who is -at fault- for obesity, I see no problem blaming the individual. Like I said previously, whether fair or not, it is simply a choice: "I have a genetic predisposition for being a fatty. I have to work harder than most to keep weight off. Do I feel like putting in the effort?" You can't effect how you came into this world, but you can damn sure make an effort to effect how you are in it, and how you come out of it. Originally posted by [GGS It shouldn't, and I'm not the type of person to go around telling people how ot live their lives at all. If someone told me how to regulate my diet, I would tell them to fuck off. But beyond that, the point isn't just that people having an image problem, or society presuring peopel to look a certain way, it is that it is a serious health risk! Being obese isn't just, "being fat". Here is the definition, from wiki: Originally posted by Wikipedia Originally posted by [GGS Forgive me for thinking that is a completely warped a demented view of things. And a bit one-dimensional and wrong as well, IMO. In the same vein I suggest we don't bother looking for treatments for alcoholism because it might hurt the beverage industry. Conversely, what about the damage that obese people are doing to the fitness industry by not working out. That arguement goes both ways. Originally posted by [GGS Hear hear. As I said, I don't tell people how to live their lives and I sure as fuck don't expect other people how to tell me to live mine. The only thing I would add is that as an idivudal you have to decide: "Do I want to live a long, healthy life?" If you don't, then don't care about the weight. If you do, then it is apparent to me that you should care about obesity. Just gotta weigh out the pros and cons, and IMHO in that regard obesity is a "bad thing". Originally posted by ||bassOriginally posted by [GGSA-freaken-men. Most people who bitch and complain about companies like McDonald's have absolutely no concept (even remotely) of how much taxes those companies end up paying. What is the point you are making with that? (edited by Gavin on 09-14-06 08:43 PM) |
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windwaker Ninji i'm not judgemental, i'm cynical Lonely People of the World, Unite! Since: 12-27-05 Last post: 6308 days Last view: 6286 days |
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Originally posted by Cruel Lameness I hate how mom-and-pop shops like McDonalds are getting so utterly ass-fucked by the government. I honestly doubt whether it'll be around in five or ten years. This is why I smoke a few packs a day; I sacrifice my lungs for those poor, poor tobacco companies. |
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Cruel Justice I have better things to do. Since: 11-18-05 From: At my house! Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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| I'm not saying that natural-selection (obese people dying in high numbers from over-indulging in fatty foods) would be RIGHT either. I just think people deserve to have a choice of how they live their lives. To hell with taxing sodas and chips. Getting told how to eat? What next? Tell us how to dress, walk and talk too? | |||
Skreename Giant Red Paratroopa Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6285 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by Gavin And when what's necessary is stigmatized as much as it is, then what? You do realize that when people reach a certain point, they require more drastic measures than "Eat healthy and work out", right? When your body adapts to a body mass that much higher than normal (no matter what the cause), you can typically lose weight... down to that body mass. Of course, I suppose you could starve yourself. Ideally you'd be down to a healthy size before your system spazzes out and kills you. As with everything, problems occur due to a lack of understanding of the whole situation. Most people seem to purely associate the problem with "I EAT TOO MUCH JUNK FOOD AND NEVER MOVE", while it could be something that the person didn't even have a choice in. You don't very well choose to stop breathing at random times during the night while you sleep, do you? Likewise, feeling like you're starving for no good reason is just loads of fun, especially if it's caused be medication that you use to try to keep yourself somewhat stable emotionally. (Honestly, I never really knew how people could get as heavy as I've seen. I did nothing but eat and sit mostly still, and I never got above about 230 lbs. I'm around 6'4, too.) |
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spiroth10 Paratroopa Since: 01-28-06 From: USA Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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| personally, I have no predjudice against the obese.
but I think there are some guidelines we should follow to help people from becomiing obese in the first place (here in the US, its a serious problem). I have friends who got obese because of genetics + severe depression at a young age. One of which is one of the strongest guys I know. and we're all pretty active. my suggestion is to be more active. I'm a (competitive) runner in school (cross country and track) and a wrestler (<- two words making weight) and I can honestly say I've never been heavier than 120 pounds (going 112 for wrestling this year). I'm healty as an ox (Doctor always says Im the healthiest he's seen for physicals), and am somewhere between 5'7" to 6' tall. the real problem with eating is not how many calories you take in -- it's how many you burn per day. When we were hunter-gatherers, we burned it off catching wolly-mammoths. walking to the grocery store does not compare. Instead of playing NBA 2k2, go get some friends and play for real. No friends? go for a 5K run. do some push ups. join karate. DO SOMETHING OTEHR THAN WATCH TV/PLAY VIDEO GAMES/GO ON THE WEB. calories have nothing to do with (or should) fat. they are merely a unit of measurement for how much energy you gain from food. fat is the result of unused energy, and is meant to store it for later use. however, when it is never used it only builds up more, until your body becomes heavier and more sluggish, and requires more energy to live. because of this, it becomes harder to lose weight, and at some point, I'd imagine it to be implausible. we need to keep people from becoming obese in the first place. teach them about healthy eating. raise kids to be more active. I know that some people become obese through medical conditions and etc., and its not their fault at all, but if you eat all day, and then just go home and sleep, you'd better bet I'll laugh at you if you cry about your weight. thats right -- Im intolerant of ignorance. Your really dumb if you thought Mickey D's french frys and sleep would keep you healthy. hell, I dont feel bad for drug addicts with brain damage either. they both knew what would result, and thus, it is THEIR OWN FAULT. don't get me wrong -- I dont hate obese people, I hate stupid people. people who smoke weed, skip class, and wonder why they're failing. People who have unprotected sex, get STDS and pay child support at age 15. these people will never have my pity. They will never gain my support. Theres a fine line between a mistake and screwing your life over, especially when there's more than one chance for you to turn back and you don't. guess thats the end of my rant here, and Im really sorry if I offended someone, it's just how I feel. let me get it straight here that Im not against people who's medical conditions cause obesity or anything else out of their control. Im just against people who make ignorant choices, because smart or not, you decided which path to choose. (edited by spiroth10 on 09-16-06 09:58 PM) |
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emcee Red Super Koopa Since: 11-20-05 Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by spiroth10 And....? |
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Tarale    2710 Affected by 'Princess Bitch-Face Syndrome' ++++!! Persona non grata Since: 11-17-05 From: Adelaide, Australia Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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 You gonna elaborate on any of that, spiroth10?
And yes, Skreenname is right in that there is a lack of understanding -- or in general a lot of misunderstanding -- about weight gain and weight loss. It IS often simplified down to an equasion where calories eaten should be less than calories burned to produce weight loss -- which would be great if the actual reality was just a simple. 
But that doesn't take into consideration things with people's metabolisms, illnesses, medications, etc, etc. So it doesn't quite work, or it doesn't work for everyone. That's the problem with oversimplifying things  |
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spiroth10 Paratroopa Since: 01-28-06 From: USA Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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| sorry about that, I edited the above post.
I accidentally hit tab+enter and submitted the reply. please re-read my post. |
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windwaker Ninji i'm not judgemental, i'm cynical Lonely People of the World, Unite! Since: 12-27-05 Last post: 6308 days Last view: 6286 days |
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I don't really see the point of this thread anymore. It's really just "don't make fun of the obese  ", and it has nothing to do with world affairs or debate, really (if there's anti-fat legislation anywhere, please point it out). |
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Tarale 2710 Affected by 'Princess Bitch-Face Syndrome' ++++!! Persona non grata Since: 11-17-05 From: Adelaide, Australia Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by windwaker No, there isn't any legislation as such, but schools are starting to change things like their cafeteria / canteen stuff because of things like this. And there are calls in Australia for our politicians to lose weight because they are being a bad role model for kids  |
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windwaker Ninji i'm not judgemental, i'm cynical Lonely People of the World, Unite! Since: 12-27-05 Last post: 6308 days Last view: 6286 days |
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Originally posted by TaraleOriginally posted by windwaker Yes. Teenagers look up to politicans oh so much. Maybe it's different in Australia. |
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Tarale 2710 Affected by 'Princess Bitch-Face Syndrome' ++++!! Persona non grata Since: 11-17-05 From: Adelaide, Australia Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by windwakerOriginally posted by TaraleOriginally posted by windwaker No, it's not.
In fact, I'm pretty sure that pollies are exactly what kids don't want to grow up into anyway. Maybe they should stay fat. |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6356 days Last view: 6299 days |
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Originally posted by SkreenameOriginally posted by Gavin As I said, preconditions for obesity are neither fun nor fair, but they are still very much a reality of life. You always have a choice of what you can do with what you were given. The sad and obective truth is that if you float by life only with a fixation on the external locus of control, you will never make much of yourself. You said this stems from a 'lack of understanding'? Understanding only has a point when it is a catalyst for change. You're missing the action-oriented part of the equation, and missing that is just as ineffective as not understanding at all. Originally posted by Skreename You have made a litany illogical statements: 1) That is a completely unfitting and incorrect analogy. 2) Balancing your intake of foods with the needs of your body is not "Starving yourself" 3) What you have described as "starving yourself" is not "for no good reason". I can't think of a better reason than maintaing the fidelity of ones person 4) I'm sorry, but I have no idea how the concept of "fun" fits into this equation at all. The point of balancing your food intake is to prevent obesity, which results in earlier death and increased risk for physical complications and general unhealthiness. It's a necessity of basic survival and health management, not meant as some Friday night out with friends event or something else "fun". And at the same time, it's not that it can't be fun, it's just not the primary function of the undertaking. I have already addresses and dismissed the points you have brought up, plesae reread my post in it's entirety. |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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| If you have a real reason, say a thyroid problem, that causes massive weight gain than my sympathy is with you.
If you sit around all day staring blankly, vacantly at a screen, eating unhealthy foods...Then you're probably the sort that whines in this thread. The overweight (lazy ones) are rightly stigmatized. They're making an active choice to be sedentry. Finding excuses to burden themselves with excessive weight (which becomes the responsibility of taxpayers when they get diabetes or need hip replacements or any other number of health problems associated with weight issues). I see it enough here "I'm not good at sports" "I have a high metabolism". If you say those words without a thought to it then you're going to end up on a super-scooty scooter to help you move, never be able to walk up stairs. All of your own doing, too. The sick thing is that most people can be content with this outcome. And will continue living in that way. |
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Tarale 2710 Affected by 'Princess Bitch-Face Syndrome' ++++!! Persona non grata Since: 11-17-05 From: Adelaide, Australia Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by Gavin Just a note -- if you suddenly drop the amount of calories you eat, the human body thinks you are starving yourself -- or in a famine -- and takes action. It holds on to bodyfat and stores more in case the famine goes on for a while, or happens again. So if you're starving yourself as a way of trying to lose weight, the body has a defense mechanism to render that pretty useless -- you can wind up putting on MORE weight... and make yourself dizzy and cranky. May as well be doing it for "no reason". Better to try to substitute what you are already eating for different things. Subtitute white bread for grainy bread. Substitute a big steak for a little one with more veg.
People should look to exercise instead -- an adult (overweight or not) needs 30 minutes of exercise a day. But yes, the idea that overweight people should be "starving themselves" really irks me. It's wrong -- it doesn't work -- and it causes MORE problems. Course, it's the first thing that they go and do, and then everyone encourages them... (edited by Tarale on 09-18-06 06:39 PM) |
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Xkeeper Took the board down in a blaze of glory, only to reveal how truly moronical ||bass is. Since: 11-17-05 From: Henderson, Nevada Last post: 6279 days Last view: 6279 days |
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Originally posted by Tarale This explains an awful lot of one o fthe reasons behind my latest seeming inability to function properly. (namely, my diet went from "somewhat regular ramen noodles and sandwiches three meals a day" to "almost nothing but occasionally leftovers or the strawberry college smoothie") |
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Sinfjotle Lordly? No, not quite.  Since: 11-17-05 From: Kansas Last post: 6280 days Last view: 6279 days |
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| It's increadibly easy to lose weight if you're willing to wait and be patient.
Make simple changes in your diet and slowly wind down to a minimum bar. Make simple changes in physical activity and increase it regularly, weekly or monthly, and over time you'll lose weight. Sure it isn't some miracle thing that'll make you lose 20 pounds in a month. (I've lost twenty pounds since I've started three months ago but damn is my hair and skin shining!) I've also put on a little muscle and am looking quite a bit better. Another three months and I'll be fit as hell, and I'm very content on waiting and becoming fit than I am on losing a lot of weight and being scrawny. |
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windwaker Ninji i'm not judgemental, i'm cynical Lonely People of the World, Unite! Since: 12-27-05 Last post: 6308 days Last view: 6286 days |
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Originally posted by XkeeperOriginally posted by Tarale Stick it out, I say. I eat one meal a day, plus maybe a spoonful of peanut butter after I wake up (I drink a lot of coffee and it cuts down on my appetite). I can't even eat three meals a day without feeling absolutely full. |
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