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| Acmlm's Board - I3 Archive - World Affairs/Debate - State Your Beliefs |
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Arwon Bazu                   Since: 11-18-05 From: Randwick, Sydney, NSW, Australia Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6296 days |
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| This came up in another board. Essentially the idea is to state your beliefs regarding politics, society, etc. The expectation is of minimal debate. Obviously, as a cynical contrarian bastard who is occasionally accused of nihilism, this was a challenge, but this is what I came up with. These are beliefs, many of these I can't defend to people with differeing beliefs because they, you know, have different beliefs. Post your own damn you.
God doesn't exist. Privileged white kids need to drop the absurd persecution complex already. Sport is a good thing. There's too much casual anti-Americanism in Australia and elsewhere. It's childish and absurdly hypocritical. Racism still exists, people have just learned to hide it better. The ecological crisis, in all its forms, will change politics utterly when it starts to bite hard. Watch for even the hardcore republicans and conservatives to turn into dictatorial Greens with rationing and restrictions and such... The market is great, but it's terrible with environmental issues or things with great social importance (health, education). Legalise all drugs. Communism sucked, but Russia and most of Eastern Europe are probably even worse-off now. Capitalism and democracy as they were applied didn't help them much, and triumphalist idiots who think these things were magical cure-alls aren't paying attention at all. Feminism is the most abused and meaningless term in politics, it essentially means something different to everyone who uses it... but people who rail against "feminism" for the most part seem to me to be doing the gender-politics equivalent of "I'm not racist, but..." We need more immigration. Everywhere. Monarchy is objectionable at a philosophical level. No government funding for wealthy private schools. I'd rather everyone get a mediocre education than some get a good one and others get a bad one. Dumb people are annoying, but smart people are often unbearable arseholes. Corrolary: Nerds mostly have sh!tty politics. Censorship is NEVER okay. Fuck obsenity laws, fuck your distaste for sexuality on TV, and fuck national security. The fact that this is unrealistic in practise doesn't mean it's not a good principle. Also, protecting kids through restrictions on access to various media isn't censorship. Religion is fine, but it needs to be reduced to a harmless peripheral cultural phenomenon that doesn't affect important things. The Swedes have the right idea. America and the Islamic world do not. The sooner it's culturally acceptable to sell dildos on the street in Tehran and for a guy to make out with another guy in public in downtown Podunk, South Carolina, the better off we will all be. If it's not in the Economist it's a stinking lie. Islamic terrorism will dissappear in its own time and the risk of terrorist attack is vastly overstated, because people have no sense of relative risk. We in the west can't do anything to hasten this terrorism's demise because it's borne from an idea independent of any specific people or entity. We have to wait for the idea to become unfashionable like others have. The big dirty secret of the war on terrorism is that none of our leaders know what to do because THERE'S NOTHING THEY CAN DO. Related: We're kept safe by the tiny number of people willing to set off bombs, not by the government's security measures and invasive laws. These laws are bogus and dangerous. |
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spiroth10 Paratroopa  Since: 01-28-06 From: USA Last post: 6295 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| I am an athiest, and I dont believe in god.
I really dont like any kind of government at all. instead I favor a mixture -- an evolved for of communism. free food (within a certain value) in regards to family size, free homes for all, a limit on procreation (like in china). everyone MUST work -- but there is still a bit of advancement, so it isnt really communism. aside from that, there is a paycheck that you get in regards to your work ethic (yes -- a bonus) for extra things. theres more but its only my dreams for a perfect government. I personally think people should look into science for answers and protection now. I dont care if you believe god will save you when the sun implodes, I want to be on the nt shuttle to the nearest earthlike planet. people should ignore each others beliefs and LET nonbelievers pay for their "sins". If I go to hell, Im paying for it, not you. go stem cell research go cloning. (we could clone an endless army -- one who loves to fight for our country, trained since birth -- like in star wars) go free speach -- NO CENSORSHIP. no software patents (done in europe, not in US. I ignore them anyway, so FBI you can kiss my behind) there IS intelligent life out there. without punishment, people will not change. there need to be consequences -- strict ones. Im for the death sentence, an eye for an eye, as it is said. education is the most important thing for the advancement and evolution of society. nature vs. nurture. let evolution control the minds of the people, not the inferior morals of their ancestors. that is what I believe. |
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beneficii Broom Hatter Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6298 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| spiroth10,
I wonder, Have you read Jonathan V. Last's "The Case for the Empire"? Anyway, er, as for my beliefs. God (or some Unifying Force) exists. I also believe that if you join a religion, you sorta need to adhere to all its principles (and all things that its scripture says) or you're sorta really not part of that religion. I am for life, though I am opposed to government-outlawed abortion, and against the death penalty except in cases where the evidence is solid and the person did something truly evil (like murder their spouse for insurance money or raped a kid then murdered them to cover it up) and against all but defensive war. I am opposed to any sort of sterilization (or other form of offspring limitation) or mass-slaughter by the government. Of course, I support people's right to defend themselves (and to use deadly force against deadly force used against them) and people's right to bear arms. I am against all forms of censorship. I think there is intelligent life out there. As for cloning, I don't know. I don't know enough about it, but I'm not exactly willing to have a government supported by total diehards who will follow every last order without thought (like the clonetroopers--Order 66). I'm opposed to compulsory education, as I think each child's case is separate, and I think that some kids are better off starting work at, say, age 12 or so then to be forced to go to a school they don't want to have anything to do with. I support the child liberation movement. I like the concept of stem cell research, but I'd prefer it if they used something other than embryos. I like the concept of being able to grow new organs. Still, no-one can live forever and it's futile to try. Something will come up and kill you in the long run. As for after death, well, the user that's behind the mind and receives input from it and controls it will probably end up just going behind something else or something else entirely. I think nature and nurture work together in the long run to produce results; it's never just one or the other. Oh, and I do believe in being suspicious of the government. |
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Thexare Metal battleaxe Off to better places  Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6295 days Last view: 6295 days |
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Originally posted by Arwon get out of my head! my thoughts aren't yours to spy on! 
May as well start on the same note as everyone else... Though I know it's impossible with our current tools to determine without doubt whether or not a higher power exists (after all, if we could, there'd be no more than one religion if that), I believe that there isn't one. When my morals conflict with those of another person, I tend to favor choice, as in the abortion debate. I am against all censorship by the government - parents exist for a reason. Our priorities are horribly mixed up. Athletes make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, yet teachers earn barely more than non-college graduates (IIRC)... something's wrong with that. A certain suspicion of everyone is good, as long as it's not taken overboard. Especially on the internet. (this may fall under common sense, I dunno, but a lot of people seem really willing to trust others) Legalize drugs. If they affect ones perceptions to a noticeable degree, add restrictions similar to those of alchohol. I understand that you might think getting high is wrong, or that you may be concerned about their health, but guess what? You're not the one doing it, so you can me a favor and quit trying to shove your morality down the throats of others. See also: second block of text. And on a lighter note... I am in favor of beating the shit out of crappy parents. Admittedly, in our current legal system that'd get me thrown in prison, but honestly... some of them need some sense knocked into them, and they don't have any that could be knocked out. |
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Arwon Bazu Since: 11-18-05 From: Randwick, Sydney, NSW, Australia Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6296 days |
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| I also steal babies. | |||
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Kingpin Since: 11-21-05 From: Amarillo, TX Last post: 6301 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| There is a God.
Abortion is wrong, no matter the circumstances. Taking Suddam out of power was a great idea, we just didnt plan it out too well. Being homosexual is wrong. People are too liberal. Things that were wrong a hundred years ago are fine now, and things that are horribly wrong now will be fine a hundred years from now. Communism is a great idea, but people have been and always will be greedy, so Communism will never work. Anarchy is a myth. Racism exists. Yep. Guess what, white people arent the only ones who are racist. If you can say n****r and cracker, then so can I. People go to extremes, and it drives me crazy. Believe in God? Great. You don't? Thats ok too. Either way, learn to do things on your own. In the end, you will be the only one who can do anything about your own life. We should shoot every immigrant that comes here illegally. Make an example out of them. I will discipline my chicldren. That means with a belt. (More later) |
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emcee Red Super Koopa Since: 11-20-05 Last post: 6295 days Last view: 6295 days |
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Originally posted by Arwon Like a dingo? I'd list my beliefs, but I don't see the point if no one can argue against them. |
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RoyChapman Chicken  Since: 07-11-06 From: Amersfoort, European Union Last post: 6505 days Last view: 6505 days |
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Originally posted by Arwon nice religion 
right.... i am a paganist, that means that i am a wicca, a witch i am against abortion, since killing children can never be justified i am against all censorship i am in favour of social democracy or economical socialism (not the soviet political form,,, thanks very much), so i am very much in favour of the welfare state. i am in favour of the draft, there is nothing wrong in doing something for your country i believe in a united europe i don't think we should support neither the us or israel since they will only lead us to war i believe in teaching your children the Old Ways, since today's society is pretty much rotten to the core i believe in nature, and i try to stay in tune with it, we should be developing a good policy to prevent the world from getting even warmer (edited by RoyChapman on 07-22-06 03:51 PM) |
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ziffhasnoaim/password Snifit Since: 06-07-06 Last post: 6487 days Last view: 6487 days |
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Originally posted by RoyChapmanOriginally posted by Arwon Were they really better? |
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||bass Administrator  Since: 11-17-05 From: Salem, Connecticut Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| I've waited for a thread like this for awhile.
Ok everyone, prepare to hate me alot.... I do NOT belive in the following: - Right to privacy - Freedom of assembly (partial) - Freedom of speech (partial) - Freedom of religion (partial) - Social welfare (partial) - The entire 4th amendment On the issues noted as "partial" Assembly: I think the following groups should be declared ilegal: hate organizations, cults, communist groups, anti abortion protests, and unions. Speech: I think these types of speech should be banned: hate speech, door-to-door religious prosyltizing, anti-government speech. Religion: Cults should be outlawed. For clarification, under my standard of cult, Jehova's Wittness is a cult, Mormons are not a cult. Social Welfare: I don't think the government should have the right to take away people's hard earned money to just give a handout to anyone for any reason. On the flipside of that, I think anyone who doesn't willingly CHOOSE to give money to charity is going to go to hell. If people would give their fair share to charity, we wouldn't need government welfare programs. Studies show that private charity is more effective than government beaurocracy. ---------------------------------- I DO belive in the following: - Capital punishment (it's not about deterrance or money or any of those incorrect reasons, sometimes people just deserve it) - The US is the best country in the history of the entire universe and no nation will ever even come close EVER - The idology of the Repuiblican party (except I think Bush is a moron for wasting money on wars when the tax dollars would be bettar spent improving things here) - The US system is better than metric, espically for cooking. |
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Arwon Bazu Since: 11-18-05 From: Randwick, Sydney, NSW, Australia Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6296 days |
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| "Studies show that private charity is more effective than government beaurocracy."
Which studies? |
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RoyChapman Chicken Since: 07-11-06 From: Amersfoort, European Union Last post: 6505 days Last view: 6505 days |
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Originally posted by ziffhasnoaim/passwordOriginally posted by RoyChapmanOriginally posted by Arwon sometimes they were, yes... in all honesty our "christian virtues" are not any good |
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||bass Administrator Since: 11-17-05 From: Salem, Connecticut Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6295 days |
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Originally posted by ArwonThis one: http://papers.nber.org/papers/W11332 The following aren't scientific studies byt use them to make the same point: http://www.mackinac.org/archives/2001/v2001-11.pdf http://www.lp.org/lpn/9902-homeless.html http://www.acton.org/ppolicy/compassion/ http://www.acton.org/ppolicy/editorials/sirico/privatecharity.html http://andrewbernstein.net/articles/7_welfarestate.htm http://www.generousgiving.org/page.asp?sec=28&page=265 http://www.self-gov.org/library/gentle-hand.html |
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ziffhasnoaim/password Snifit Since: 06-07-06 Last post: 6487 days Last view: 6487 days |
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Originally posted by RoyChapmanOriginally posted by ziffhasnoaim/passwordOriginally posted by RoyChapmanOriginally posted by Arwon You want to substantiate that? |
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Arwon Bazu Since: 11-18-05 From: Randwick, Sydney, NSW, Australia Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6296 days |
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| So you're basing this on Libertarian sources and what happened with church organisations during the Depression? Grand. I think I'll stick with Centrelink (our bureaucratic but servicable government welfare bureacracy, which pays for my dinner and keeps me from running myself into the ground trying to scratch together rent).
Hey, how does faith-based charity work when you have a secular society with like we do now where hardly anyone goes to church, let alone donates? How would charity pay old age pensions or student benefits or disability payments? Do atheists and others with deviant lifestyles get support? Why should we rely on the good grace and agendas of church organisations to cover society's lack of ability to keep people from starving in the streets? Why is it that it is demonstrably harder to get by if you're poor in the 1st world country with the least-developed social welfare system, than in other first world countries? Should we take this to a new thread? (edited by Arwon on 07-23-06 06:41 PM) |
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Tommathy Since: 11-17-05 From: Cloud Nine, Turn Left and I'm There~ Last post: 6295 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| Just like ||bass, I shall try to stick to the concrete and not the purely philosophical.
I disagree strongly with: - "Don't ask, don't tell" - Government intereference in marriage and other contracts (see below) - All political parties (their ideologies, not their existence) - "Zero Tolerance" policies - On the flip-side, the idea of employee "empowerment" - National Sales Tax - The new bankruptcy law - "One Size Fits All" primary and secondary education. Marriage and other contracts: More generally, the whole gay marriage debate. More specifically, the Virginia Marriage Affirmation Act, which reads in part: A civil union, partnership contract or other arrangement between persons of the same sex purporting to bestow the privileges or obligations of marriage is prohibited. Which can be taken to mean that if I enter in a private contract that happens to possibly give a benefit similar to the thousand tax breaks and property rights agreements that relate to marriage, it can be declared void by the state. I agree with: - The US is one of the most succesful social experiments in recorded history, although that doesn't mean it couldn't be *better* - The private sector will always be vastly more efficient than the public, but cannot be depended upon to provide all services. - Legal assisted euthanasia. spiroth10 Do you write software? Thexare People pay for what they value. Take that how you will. Kario We know how this is going to go, and I don't really feel like getting into it with you. RoyChapman Economical means thrifty or affordable, Economic means relating to commerce and trade. ||bass Not that I'm pro-union or anything, ||bass, especially considering the state of unions as they stand today, but why shouldn't groups of workers be allowed to band together to negotiate? Further on the subject of assembly, why couldn't a group of individuals contract with eachother to share their resources equally a la communism? It would basically an (albeit extreme) extension of the concept of a co-op, consortium, or corporation, where large groups of people pool their resources for profit, except these people would be pooling *all* of their resources. If a person chooses to voluntarily surrender their assets to a commune, who are we to stop them? On the subject of speech: what falls under the purview of "anti-government" speech? Do you simply mean pro-anarchy commentary or criticism of the government in power? On the outlawing of cults: again, I'm no fan of the JWs either, but should the government really be taking my hard-earned money away from me to arrest and jail a bunch of praying wackos who don't want blood transfusions? Before I discuss social welfare, what falls under this guise? Unemployment benfits? Food stamps? Tax breaks for dependents? Social security? Free/Reduced school lunch? Education? And finally, the Fourth Amendment? Really? Would this only be the government that can waltz into your house whenever they want, or could I drop by anytime too? Are merely saying that society should be completely transparent to the government, or that we should all be comepletely transparent to eachother? |
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||bass Administrator Since: 11-17-05 From: Salem, Connecticut Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6295 days |
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I've cut out the sections that weren't clearly questions directed ae me.Originally posted by Tommathy Assembly: When I said communist groups, I was thinking more along the lines of a political party. If people want to go form a commune and not bother anybody, that's a-ok with me. Speech: I meant pro-anarchy or any similar group advocating an overthrow of the government. Welfare: All of it. If people would go and DONATE a fair share, a REAL fair share, we wouldn't need ANY government type programs. Unemployed people, old people, students, etc. Everybody can benefit from good old-fashioned charity. 4th Amendment: I am strongly of the belief that good honest people should have nothing to hide. If people would just grow the fuck up about issues such as homosexuality, we wouldn't NEED privacy because a mature public really shouldn't give a shit where someone sticks his dick as long as said 'location' is over 18. The problem is that some people can't deal with that. If the public would just grow up, we wouldn't need privacy laws because the only people who would need to hide anything would be criminals. If people were really confortable with themselves and their choices, they shouldn't have to feel the need to hide their actions. (The previous sentence does not apply to dirty commies.) PS: Also. Say Bob gave $10,000 to charity every year. This is all he can afford to give. Suddenly the government begins to tax him $5,000 a year for the purposes of welfare. Bob can now afford to give only $5,000 a year to charity. Furthermore, he feels ok since $10,000 of his money is still going to "the public good". Problem: Government beaurocracy/corruption/mismanagement does not to as good of a job as the Red Cross or the local church. In turn, only $9,000 of Bob's money is actually going to people who need it. The other $1,000 was absorbed by government overhead costs, corrupt beaurocrats embezzling the money, and just plain incompetant people mismanaging public funds. (edited by ||bass on 07-23-06 10:42 PM) |
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ziffhasnoaim/password Snifit Since: 06-07-06 Last post: 6487 days Last view: 6487 days |
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| I have yet to see private charity instituted on a nation wide level. It has never been done effectively. The state system with taxation, on the other hand, has proven to be very effective. | |||
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||bass Administrator Since: 11-17-05 From: Salem, Connecticut Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| Who said the charity has to be nationwide. If everyone donated to their LOCAL charity, the whole thing would work, albeit decentralized. | |||
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ziffhasnoaim/password Snifit Since: 06-07-06 Last post: 6487 days Last view: 6487 days |
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| So how would you assure equal quality of education and relative curriculum across the board, then? |
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| Acmlm's Board - I3 Archive - World Affairs/Debate - State Your Beliefs |
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