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| Acmlm's Board - I3 Archive - ROM Hacking - Zelda II Information |
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Arthus  140                   Since: 11-17-05 From: Australia Last post: 6497 days Last view: 6497 days |
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| I've almost got an overworld editor working, I know where most of the data is, how it's formatted, what number represents what tile and I know how to write to a picture, so all i have to do is figure out how to deisplay the info in the actual pic. | |||
Shadic The Adventure of Link Perfect Member  Since: 11-18-05 From: Olympia, Washington Last post: 6291 days Last view: 6287 days |
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| I look forward to seeing this in action.
So, is the warp editing going to be supported at first? (AKA, step onto a town, go to Mido.) |
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Arthus 140 Since: 11-17-05 From: Australia Last post: 6497 days Last view: 6497 days |
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| It really depends if I can find the pointers for it, if I can, then it will. If not, you will have to edit around it. | |||
Ice Ranger Grizzo  Since: 11-24-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6285 days |
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| I figured you could use dwedit's editor to find the warp locations for those as well. I documented most of the ones for Western Hyrule (wrote down the values shown in dwedit's editor, so not really documenting I guess). I did have a problem moving the 1st Palace somewhere else though (Link was a green box, only level graphics being white showed up and no enemy graphics). I moved the first palace below the first town to cause that.
Maybe you can only have so many towns/palaces on the X or Y axis, I don't know. The palace worked fine when it was placed a few places left and down from the old palace. EDIT: Has anyone figured out how the entrance to Death Mt. or the raft locations work yet? I changed the raft location for West Hyrule but it sent me to the bridge to the Maze Island in East Hyrule, I back tracked to the raft location on East Hyrule to be sent to the "new" raft location at West Hyrule. Also, with Death Mt. entrance, I couldn't get it to work at all by changing it to some locataions. By the way, I should mention I didn't use the editor to make the changes, but through hexidecimal. (edited by Ice Ranger on 03-15-06 12:56 PM) |
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Jigglysaint Octoballoon  Since: 11-19-05 Last post: 6304 days Last view: 6290 days |
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| Post some offsets. I think I'll take a quick look before I go out today.
Okay, the editor does show the right data, but you have to manually scroll though thousands of byte to get them to align with other maps. I found that the start of the death mountain locations is at 610C for the Y, 614B for X, 618A for Z, and 61C9 for W. All are hex addresses of course. As for the some warps, the world number tells the game what world to load from. Of course the 4 overworlds go from 0 to 3, and palace 1 is C. I'll have to figure out this stuff, but a lot of it is self explanitory. (edited by Jigglysaint on 03-15-06 03:17 PM) |
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Ice Ranger Grizzo Since: 11-24-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6285 days |
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| Ok, I updated the info at datacrystal.org again. It now has some of the data from dwedit's editor as well as the mappings for some sprites and what pallet/graphic sets to use for all the palaces. The latest find, which wasn't too difficult, is the amount of magic needed for each spell at each level magic is. Note that after those locations is how the spells can have multiple effects (fire, reflect, and thunder for example from one spell).
The main thing I'm having trouble finding is how to change how many magic containers are needed for spells (fire, reflect, spell, thunder). Also, I am trying to figure out how to add (that's going to be difficult) another magic container and heart container into the game (find out how the bits work and add one in somewhere). That should give you something to look at for awhile. Jigglysaint already told me some stuff to look for (properties related to the beam). No luck yet though. |
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Jigglysaint Octoballoon Since: 11-19-05 Last post: 6304 days Last view: 6290 days |
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| I believe each container adds 16 hp, and link starts with 7f woth of HP. 7f + 3f is BF, which I think is the in-game max. However, there is a certain point where too many containers will glitch the game.
Right now I am doing more research on palace petrification. So far, I've found that when the nessicary bits are set in ram(crystal set and item gotten), the row that's selected will be replaced with byte 0B in ram. Now, unless the row is only 1 tile big, it will mess the overwold up. If I can get that 0b changed to another tile or length, then it should be possible to have things like roads opening up after finishing a palace, or caves appearing, or things like that. Edit: You can't have more than 256 hp, which means you can't add any extra health. Best thing to do is to maybe make that red ring that acts as a perma-shield spell. I did some fiddling, and found the byte that determines what enemy ist ransformed when you use Spell. I think the wizards for the 2nd 4 towns might have a compare set up so there is a minimul you need. Since you start with 4 containsrs, I bet that each town looks to see if you have a container that matches it's order. For example, if you hacked out all but one container, only the first town will give you a spell. I need to test this. Edit: I confermed that you do indeed need the MC number for each town. So fofr example you need 1 MC for shield, 2 for jump, 3 for Life, ect. However, since you start with 4, the wizards won't tell you to come back, but will just fail to set the bit for the spell usage. Also I think othes use this as well, like the lady in New Kasuto who gives you a magic container if you allready have 7(it's the 7th town and gives you the 7th spell). (edited by Jigglysaint on 03-17-06 09:37 PM) (edited by Jigglysaint on 03-17-06 09:45 PM) |
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Shadic The Adventure of Link Perfect Member Since: 11-18-05 From: Olympia, Washington Last post: 6291 days Last view: 6287 days |
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| That would add an interesting element as well, if even the beginning towns had requirements for their magic spells..
I'm just curious, has any information been found out about the enemies? |
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Arthus 140 Since: 11-17-05 From: Australia Last post: 6497 days Last view: 6497 days |
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| Ice Ranger found a lot of HPs for enemies. | |||
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Bit-Blade Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6310 days Last view: 6405 days |
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| Would it be possible to have more than 6 petrifying dungeon? I have an idea of having a complex of sorts (say, a mountain or a rock formation that, at certain places evenly spread are small chunks of levels. Mini-palaces, perhaps, or longer than that).
On a curious note, how feasible or infeasible an idea would the following idea be and why? As we all know, the overworld is quite limited in terms of its lack of interactability as compared to zelda 1. I have always been interested in the idea of a zelda game that mixed its original game play style with dangerous places like dungeons and caves. It would be, in a sense, combining elements of the 2D sidescrolling "adventure" areas of zelda 2 with nearly identical zelda-1-play-style overworld areas. A literal realization of this idea is more than likely more trouble than it's worth, so that is not what I'm suggesting. My idea is just how far zelda 2 might be prodded into enhancing its overworld gameplay given the propper coersion. I am unsure of the practicability of the ideal in the previous paragraph. There are a few issues I think would be particurly difficult to overcome. For instance, there are only 3 mobile sprites other than yourself (fairy, weak enemy sillouete, strong enemy sillouete, and all they do is move randomly (as far as I can tell) until they either catch you, you avoid them, or they avoid you). Upon contact with your sprite they act as doorways to 2d wilderness areas that are the nature of the tiles you walk on). Furthermore, there is the question of the interactability of the small link sprite in this mode of the game. It seems that all things either act as solid barriers of some nature: some that can be removed, all forests can be chopped down- they reset too far away from the focus of the screen- they reveal unseen things at times, some water can be walked on when certain prerequisites are in place, places that can be triggered into an interactable area (in 2D it would be a place like the Magic Key Shrine in New Kasuto), and ports as access points for the raft. While destroying certain stones and chopping down the forests directly affects his environment, link cannot attack or use magic. He is limited to walking and avoiding. Doubtless, the game would be incredibly difficult to coerce into a more diverse and interactable overworld. Even such things as introducing more enemy varieties would be difficult. If link cannot attack them, in what meaningful way could he interact with them? Working withing the ideas of zelda 2s framework, would it be possible to create a special sprite that could be triggered into walking around the overworld by stepping on a certain environment tile- the sprite would, as other mobile overworld sprites, warp you to an area assigned to it, only accesible through it? Basically, you could say I am most interested in how the physics and anything gameplay related could be either feasibly augmented or specific parts tweaked/modified into something different. The more interesting this game can be made (within reason), the better it will be for hacking. |
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Jigglysaint Octoballoon Since: 11-19-05 Last post: 6304 days Last view: 6290 days |
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| Well, I am not sure about much of the stuff you've said, but so far I've found a few things:
First of all, it appears as if certain events, for example the spot you play the flute to open the 6th palace has an east and a west hyrule entry. The river demon also has 2 entries. Funny thing is I can change which tile is affected by the flute, but it doesn't change the barrier from non-walkable to walkable. Also the byte I altered was for east hyrule, so it only changed there. This is good though, as this means that there could be room to have different events(all triggered by link's position and maybe a d-pad entry) for different areas of the game. As for petrification, I still haven't figured it out yet, but I do know that when the conditions are set, that is 2 certain bytes in ram are set, the place where the rock is to appear will change to 0B. It might be possible to change it to somthing else, but as a general reminder, usually ram updates like this require both graphics and physics changes in 2 different ares. That means you could most likely change the way it loks, but not the way it acts unless you find the other byte. As for adding these, it might be possibe depending where the code is. There are 6 palaces, but 8 items. I bet you could add in 2 extra max, but it would trigger upon getting the item not beating the dungeon. |
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Dwedit Rope フクト オン フォニクス  Since: 11-17-05 From: Chicago! Last post: 6286 days Last view: 6286 days |
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Originally posted by Bit-Blade If you want to rewrite the Zelda 2 overworld engine, then you could do whatever you want. I'm sure there's tons of empty space inside Zelda 2. |
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Bit-Blade Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6310 days Last view: 6405 days |
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| I'm not talking rewrite, bro. I doubt anyone would care to put that much effort into my beloved little blacksheep zelda 2, I was merely stating my case as informatively as I could, though I tend to go to unecesary extremes. You could say I laid all my cards on the table.
Feasibly, any enhancements to the overworld engine would be wonderful. If I were an ASM guru, I'd do this as extensively as I could on my own or with advice from my contemporaries. I might even take that route eventually. I don't imagine many people feel like wasting such amounts of effort and time into zelda 2, even though I would had I the knowledge. Besides, dwedit, it's fun to conjecture about things, don't you think? |
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Ice Ranger Grizzo Since: 11-24-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6285 days |
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| Whew, found some more data related to palettes (those for Link's sprite after casting a spell/defeating a boss). The light brown color, the green are now documented. They are stored in a different place in the ROM so anyone should be able to fix that now (not so much the skin tone, didn't bother documenting that since I wasn't looking for it).
Found some PPU data (is that even that right word?) for tiles in a few different areas, it's nowhere near complete, so I guess it doesn't matter much. Completed the table for how many experience points are given for each type. I still can't find where that information is stored in RAM (is all that information linked together with only the enemy ID or something? I've been searching for specific enemy experience for a long time now.) Jigglysaint, would you happen to know the offsets to change how many magic containers for each town is needed to gain the spell are located? I'm thinking about having the player start the game with one magic container (since 0 will glitch the game) and make one of the earlier towns give a better spell (I don't know where the data for what spell will be given is either yet) when returned to after gaining all 8 magic containers. Oh, and possibly the offsets for the temple petrification as well (along with the item needed for petrification). Whew, I'll keep checking for enemy statistics and mappings for them. |
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Jigglysaint Octoballoon Since: 11-19-05 Last post: 6304 days Last view: 6290 days |
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| I don't think you can change how man MC you need for a spell, since my guess is that it's linked directly to the town number. Remember that in the first 4 towns, even if you don't meet the requisite MC's, the game assumes you do and gives you the message as if you had them, yet doesn't give it to you. The best option I see, is re-do all the spells so that powerful one is first on the list, then lock it away with an item you need to find, like the child or trophy.
As for palaces, I haven't looked, but I bet that each petrification event looks to see of 2 bits are set, then follows the routine. I don't know where in the rom the events are stored. |
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Ice Ranger Grizzo Since: 11-24-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6285 days |
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Found the experience locations (for Western Hyrule). It's located after the enemy HP and before the mappings for the enemies. I used corruption in the area I thought it would be and discovered this is how everything is determined. 0000 0000 - if the first two bits are turned off, the enemy uses Link's palette 0100 0000 - if the second bit is turned on, the enemy uses the first enemy palette 1000 0000 - if the first bit is turned on, the enemy uses the second enemy palette 1100 0000 - if the first two bits are turned on, the enemy uses the third enemy palette 0001 0000 - if the fourth bit is turned on, the enemy steals experience 0010 0000 - if the third bit is turned on, the enemy has an armored defense (need Fire) For the last 4 bits, those are the experience. Since there are 16 different types of experience, the higher the hexidecimal value, the more experience it gives you 00 - none 01 - 2 02 - 3 03 - 5 04 - 7 05 - 10 06 - 20 07 - 30 08 - 50 09 - 100 0A - 150 0B - 200 0C - 300 0D - 500 0E - 700 0F - 1000 |
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Shadic The Adventure of Link Perfect Member Since: 11-18-05 From: Olympia, Washington Last post: 6291 days Last view: 6287 days |
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| That is a great find!
I'm already having fun thinking about the little changes I could have with the experience table... Also, is it just me, or is Link's palette different? The brown seems darker, but it might just be my eyes as compared to the TV is used to play Zelda II on in my younger days.. |
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Ice Ranger Grizzo Since: 11-24-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6285 days |
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Originally posted by Shadic When I was experimenting with changing the palettes, including the one used after spells and such, I decided to hack a lot of the palettes the game uses, I forgot that I was doing all the searching on the one I already hacked. EDIT: Noticing that is how enemy data is stored, the possibility of damage an enemy performs is associated with other properties such as magic stealing, rock shooting, fire shooting, being invisable unless the cross is in possession. (it's probable, but most likely the damage will not be stored in a byte by itself and was merged with other properties using the bits). I'll have to look into it more. (edited by Ice Ranger on 03-20-06 04:15 PM) |
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Arthus 140 Since: 11-17-05 From: Australia Last post: 6497 days Last view: 6497 days |
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| Well progress is coming nicely on the overworld editor, it's starting to load tiles, but not in the exact way of the game, but you can recognize them.
Also, if someone can find the offset/byte that controls the length of the sword projectile that would be great. [Edit] Also, the byte that tells the game to go to the next line on the overworld map would be good. (edited by Arthus on 03-23-06 12:10 AM) |
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Ice Ranger Grizzo Since: 11-24-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6285 days |
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| Hmm, I'll have to figure out the RLE compression (I think that's what someone said the Overworld uses).
All of the bits (exp. palette, armored, exp. stealing) and HP locations have now been documented at datacrystal.org. Western and Eastern Hyrule, Palace Types 1 and 2, and the Grand Palace (which uses many unused sprites (anyone want some Deelers and Moas in the Grand Palace?). Still having trouble sorting through some of the other information that is loaded in between the HP and misc. bits locations. Don't know exactly what they do yet or which bytes affect which enemies. That should be good for awhile. I'll try to find the mapping locations for all the sprites so the editor might possibly be able to load that correctly (possibly show the hacked sprites?) Big thanks goes to Dwedit for his editor for giving me the sequence the sprites appear in, made finding data a lot easier. |
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