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| Acmlm's Board - I3 Archive - World Affairs/Debate - mm... tastes like justice... |
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Gavin Cheep-cheep Vandalism is not tolerated                    Since: 11-17-05 From: IL, USA Last post: 6371 days Last view: 6314 days |
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http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/12/20/intelligent.design.ap/index.html
article excerpts: ahahaha  . Anyway, I'm glad they stopped trying to teach philosophy in science class and rooted out those hypocritical liars. |
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Sinfjotle Lordly? No, not quite.  Since: 11-17-05 From: Kansas Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6294 days |
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I saw it coming a long way off, it was kind of obvious.  I mean, is anyone going to be surprised about this really? |
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Deleted User Banned    Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6295 days |
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| I took it all in, and will tell you. It's up to the school board to chose the curriculum. The funny thing is, people are becoming more and more stupid. I've been working on a theory, at this point those who are home schooled and are taught ID seem to be more able to get though life. Some are morons and assholes, then the others are truthful. I've been checking this board for while, and I've come the conclusion, that many of the people here are morons, or assholes, there are very few that are not, most of them seem not to care about this board anymore.
I was looking though one of the other threads, and I found that none of you back up our fucking statements. It takes a learned person to cope with the fucking assholes that ask, ask, and can't fucking give any evidence of there own. I don't give a damn if anything happens to me, but you morons need to learn to learn. Now defend your views you bunch of bitches. |
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Sukasa Birdo Not quite as active as before. Xkeeper supporter Xk > ||bass I IP Banned myself! Twice!  Since: 11-17-05 From: Somewhere over there Last post: 6295 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| You first.
Religion does not belong in a public school. There are many people who are not religios (I am one of those people), or do not share that religion. Therefore, requiring those teachings would not respect the rights of those who don't believe in Intelligent Design, and therefore I agree with the judge. That's my view, take it or leave it. |
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Rydain Sir Kibble Blaze Phoenix Runs with the Dragon Within  Since: 11-18-05 From: State College, PA Last post: 6299 days Last view: 6295 days |
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Originally posted by EzorHere's a better idea...now learn that signing up for message boards for the sole purpose of repeatedly insulting the board population en masse is a Very Bad Idea. Umkay? Umkay. Y GOODBAI THAR BUTTSECKS Edit - I can't take credit for the actual grey spraypainting, but I can add some content to my post.  I was very happy to hear this verdict, especially the smackdowns inherent in the judge's opinion. Intelligent design is religious philosophy and therefore does not deserve equal time in biology class in a public school. If a private school or church wants to espouse ID, that's fine and dandy with me, but a state-run institution cannot endorse religion.(edited by Rydain on 12-20-05 10:57 PM) |
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emcee Red Super Koopa Since: 11-20-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| I don't know, I thought it was kind of funny. Not exactly sure what he was going on about, but I got a good chuckle out of it. | |||
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Lordlazer Newcomer Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6672 days Last view: 6672 days |
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| I find this very amusing and it saddens me on how pathetic, how narrow-minded, how grounded people are in their ways that they can’t see the bigger picture. Sure, you could argue that this unconstitutional, but it isn’t; the only thing that is unconstitutional is their ruling. I quote from Computer and Academic Freedom News
“Freedom of speech means nothing if "unreasonable" and "offensive" speech is banned. And free speech is not an interest--it is an inalienable right. As for "hostile environment"--like "community standards," which was also foisted upon us by a right-wing Court--it's a term that is dangerous because it means everything and nothing. *Environment* has no objective meaning. Anything you per- ceive--including the way I dress--can be construed as part of your environment. If you hate unions, and I wear my National Writers Union button, I have introduced a hostile element into "your" environment. If you don't like my but- ton tell me. Or walk away. But don't take away my right to wear it. The right to speak includes the right to talk back and also the right not to listen. My First Amendment rights are lim- ited by your First Amendment rights, and we are equal under the law. *This* is the proper way to adjudicate charges of verbal harassment. Universities, instead, "balance" First Amendment rights against a bogus pseudo-right--a "right" to an inoffensive environment where no one is ever allowed to say anything that might conceivably offend someone else or hurt their feelings.” Next, I quote from the CNN article on ID. “Text of the statement on "intelligent design" that Dover Area High School administrators have been reading to students at the start of biology lessons on evolution: The Pennsylvania Academic Standards require students to learn about Darwin's theory of evolution and eventually to take a standardized test of which evolution is a part. Because Darwin's theory is a theory, it continues to be tested as new evidence is discovered. The theory is not a fact. Gaps in the theory exist for which there is no evidence. A theory is defined as a well-tested explanation that unifies a broad range of observations. Intelligent design is an explanation of the origin of life that differs from Darwin's view. The reference book, "Of Pandas and People," is available in the library along with other resources for students who might be interested in gaining an understanding of what intelligent design actually involves. With respect to any theory, students are encouraged to keep an open mind. The school leaves the discussion of the origins of life to individual students and their families. As a standards-driven district, class instruction focuses upon preparing students to achieve proficiency on standards-based assessments.” If this is all that the school was saying or even if they were saying more, it is their right. In addition, by them teaching Darwin’s theory, they are imposing a belief. Darwin believed in the big-bang theory and that still doesn’t explain why it happened. Nothing that we know of explains why it happened, which is why we have religions. By the school saying, “With respect to any theory, students are encouraged to keep an open mind. The school leaves the discussion of the origins of life to individual students and their families. As a standards-driven district, class instruction focuses upon preparing students to achieve proficiency on standards-based assessments”, they are leaving the choice still up to the students. However, they are introducing or/and giving the students more information on ID. By doing so they are actually being constitutional, because they are giving them more knowledge instead of strongly influencing that there is only one way. To remind you all, “Because Darwin’s theory is a theory, it continues to be tested as new evidence is discovered. Intelligent design is an explanation of the origin of life that differs from Darwin’s view. The reference book, “of Pandas and People,” is available in the library along with other resources for students who might be interested in gaining an understand of what intelligent design actually involves.” |
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Arwon Bazu Since: 11-18-05 From: Randwick, Sydney, NSW, Australia Last post: 6295 days Last view: 6295 days |
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| I don't think you could successfully argue that the US Constitutional protection of freedom of speech protects the right to force schools to teach pseudoscientific idiocy in their cirriculum.
Because let's be perfectly clear here, Intelligent Design is idiocy. Fuck mincing words about "beliefs" and stuff, Intelligent Design is pseudoscientific religious mumbo jumbo, it is aimed at getting a foot in the door in the ludicrous fight for Creationism. Creationism is unscientific, and flies in the face of all of modern biology, geology, not to mention a host of other sciences. There is no other reason to advocate teaching Intelligent Design, unless you actually believe they should teach Young Eaarth Creationism. ID has no justification other than as a stepping stone to Creationism and biblical literalism. |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| Teach creationism and such in religion/mythology.
Biology is for science. Not waving magical voodoo skulls around and cutting chickens to appease dark gods. |
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Lordlazer Newcomer Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6672 days Last view: 6672 days |
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| I'm not saying take a whole class period to teach it. I'm saying that if all they did was read those paragraphs, that was a rediculous ruling. They are sharing their opinions on something. As far as I'm concerned. If the parents or students don't like it, they can go elsewhere. It is a free country, they can move.
For a college final, I made a paper on a school I would make [no it didn't have religion in the paper, so no need to go for this point]. I included a system that would include the parents more and said that the school had the right to transfer its students if it was thought they were hindering the others from learning. In addition, they held the right to fine the parents a small fee, because clearly they or some other source was effecting them. In any case, the idea for the paper was to get more parent involvement amongst other things. The reason I brought that up is that the parents can move or the school board could rule that right [if they don't have it already] to move that student to a different school if the people have a problem with what they are doing. The country is big. I mean, if you don't like your neighbor you'll try to get them to move or you'll move [or put up with it]. If something you don't like is happening due to the city, you'll move or try to vote and get some things changed [I don't think I need to list more examples]. |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| If you read the court ruling the parents were in favour of it.
I find it funny that the education system is on such a decline because of a bunch of ignorant hicks that managed to get university degrees from Bubba's Bible College. edit: "It's a free country, the can move" Perhaps you've tried holding down a job. It requires you to be in a specific geographic location in order to go to. If you choose to lose that job and it is a specialize position (the one that often pays for a family) good luck trying to find a new one. The courts ruled on this. It can be appealed and now more money that should be used to fight a more worthy fight is going to waste. (edited by Ziff on 12-21-05 12:55 PM) |
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6295 days |
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| Because let's be perfectly clear here, Darwin's throry is idiocy. screw mincing words about "beliefs" and stuff, Darwin's throry is pseudoscientific mumbo jumbo, it is aimed at getting a foot in the door in the ludicrous fight against Creationism.
There is no other reason to advocate teaching Darwin's throry, unless you actually believe they should teach the old earth theory. Darwin's throry has no justification other than as a stepping stone against Creationism and biblical literalism. The things the contry were founded on are falling apart in the world. Du vada kunin wo kumo. |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| What are you even talking about?
Darwin used TONNES of examples to back up his theory. "Because let's be perfectly clear here, Darwin's throry is idiocy. screw mincing words about "beliefs" and stuff, Darwin's throry is pseudoscientific mumbo jumbo, it is aimed at getting a foot in the door in the ludicrous fight against Creationism. " You may call his theory psuedo-scientific when you get a degree and have conducted thousands of hours of research that is plausible and well done that counteract every shred of evidence that he has presented in favour of his theory. And what is ludicrous about a fight that the only organization in the world that has the right to speak for Christians, the Catholic Church, has deemed moronic? |
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MathOnNapkins  1100  In SPC700 HELL Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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Originally posted by Bookworm What makes more sense: getting scientific lectures from someone in a real scientific field like geology, or getting scientific lectures from a preacher in Alabama who says stuff like "well that can't be true because of [insert denying claim about physics]"? I've watched creationist videos online before, in particular, one Nebetsu posted a link to. I'll say that the lecturers are persuasive, however, if I use common sense who do I trust? I don't let the people at Burger King do my taxes, now do I? |
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Sin Dogan  860  Uoodo Original Blend Armored Trooper Votoms Canned Coffee! Since: 11-17-05 Last post: 6298 days Last view: 6297 days |
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| The problem isn't religion. The problem is that people always have to associate a name with something. There always has to exist this idiotic dichotomy where people who believe one thing are on one side and the others are on the other side. Why do people keep on insisting that evolution and religious beliefs are incompatible? That's just stupid. (edited by Jin Dogan on 12-21-05 04:43 PM) |
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Ziff B2BB BACKTOBASICSBITCHES Since: 11-18-05 From: A room Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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Originally posted by Jin Dogan Because they're stupid? |
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Sinfjotle Lordly? No, not quite. Since: 11-17-05 From: Kansas Last post: 6296 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| As a person who can see a common thing that doesn't even touch any part of anything of a religion, it is obvious to see, that God could have created evolution to make the world work.
Really, why not. As soon as someone can point out one part of intelligent design that is true, that's ok, I guess, I'll view the theory of ID as something worthwhile. Also, somewhere it said theories aren't facts, theories are explanations of something or other with the best science has to offer, including scientific facts. Loarlazer: The freedom of speach is a freedom to say anything we want, assuming it won't harm anyone. However, you can get fired because of what you said, you can get kicked out of places, but the government can't do anything to you. (Yeah, FCC does abuse the goddamn thing, but oh well.) As long as there is another station to turn to (T.V. for example) they can do whatever they want on any channel, as long as there is an alternative. I can't walk out on class. I can't move away from my city and my house. I can't get home schooled. So what am I supposed to do? That's right, I'd have to suffer, you'd have to violate my right to be aithest, the government can't do that, the state can't do that, so the school can't do that. I hope that explains it to you. |
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Metal Man88 Gold axe It appears we have been transported to a time in which everything is on fire! Since: 11-17-05 Last post: 6294 days Last view: 6294 days |
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| I went through quite a bit of independent study. I am an athiest. Whenever people try to tell me something else than evolution in a classroom, it can and will offend me, especially if there is no recourse for evading it/telling them my viewpoint/seeing that it is not government sponsored. Thusly if they really do wish to teach this "ID", then they need three separate classes: Evolution, Creationism, and ID. A person would have to take one of them; if they choose, they could take all three. Either way, the classes would make no statements about what was right or wrong; merely three ideas and any evidence which does support their existance. It is understanding we need, not a lack of it. Of course, this may run into problems. What about the other religions and their views on the creation of the world? It'd take hundreds of classes to include them too.
In the end, it's uncool to force people to think one way or another. |
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Deleted User Banned Since: 05-08-06 Last post: None Last view: 6295 days |
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| That's right, I'd have to suffer, you'd have to violate my right to be Christian, the government can't do that, the state can't do that, so the school can't do that.
"Why do people keep on insisting that evolution and religious beliefs are incompatible? That's just stupid." Because of the inconsistencies of evolution, it can not explain the complexity of the human eye. The eye is one of the most complex things in the universe. ~ Darwin's Black Box. Metal Man, I can say the same thing in return. Du kada mathma ko nita mi taka. |
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Lordlazer Newcomer Since: 11-18-05 Last post: 6672 days Last view: 6672 days |
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| I understand what you are saying, that you "can't" move out, but you are wrong. What you mean to say is that you don't want to move out or you'd be in a worse situation than you are. I don't know your age, but due to your answer I'm thinking that you are under 18. If that is the case, like I said, you wouldn't want to move out, because you'd be in a worse situation.
Also, as to being forced to do something or be subjected to something you don't like. I get that usually every or every other day. Guess what, I put up with it. Here is an example, though it is on a whole different issue. At the college I go to, sometimes they watch a channel in the dorm lobby and I don't want to watch that channel. I don't want to be subjected to such things that the channel is conveying, either due to bordom or by what it is saying or I simply don't like it. You could say, watch TV in your room, well I don't have a TV and I don't want to be subjected to nothing, in this case, having no TV. You could say that I should buy a TV. I don't want to be subjected to wasting my money when I can watch it on the 4th floor for free. In addition, I don't have a place for it in my room. In other words, like I said, I'm being subjected to things I don't want to be subjected to every day or every other day. I deal with it or I move away from it, depending on what it is. It is as simple as that. I don't go and say that their opinion sucks ass and that they can't watch that show because I hate it or for whatever reason. I'm not that rude, I respect [or try to] every opinion, as long as they can give a reason more than "I just like it" or something along those lines. "it is obvious to see, that God could have created evolution to make the world work." Sure, that is possible, but I'm not saying that evolution shouldn't be there. What I was commenting on was that the big-bang theory doesn't explain anything. Sure, God could have used that method, but even so it still comes to this [if you don't believe in God]. What made the explosion? Then some people say it was matter [or whatever]. What created that? How did that get there? Hmm? "you'd have to violate my right to be aithest" They aren't forcing you to believe in ID, they are introducing the topic or/and pushing towards it, but isn't that was advertisments do? TV is violating my right to decide by slowly brainwashing me by their ad's some might say and they would be right to a certain extent. When one hears anything enough they start to think more about it. Those that are weak minded just go with the flow, while it makes the strong minded to think about it more. I hope that explains it to you.  |
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