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2 users currently in General Chat:  Dark Vampriel |
| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - General Chat - Stirring the pot? Maybe~ |
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Krel Goomba Level: 9 Posts: 12/22 EXP: 2227 For next: 935 Since: 07-24-04 Since last post: 5 hours Last activity: 64 days |
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Oi, you guys are being melodramatic still xDOriginally posted by Jizuko Quoted for truth. And btw, tom isn't replying because he's sleeping, but I'm sure he'll be more reasonable when he returns. |
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Bit-Blade Pixel Artist Level: 34  Posts: 158/445 EXP: 229264 For next: 24387 Since: 03-16-04 Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 7 hours |
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| I think that basing this decision so heavily on Post Count and Post activity was also a bad idea. Take me, for instance. I am a lurker. I lurk lurk lurk and don't post much. At TEK, I was an Admin. While I hardly posted all that much, I was looked over many of the forums regularly. Just because someone does not post often does not mean they are not there, watching out. | |||
Ran-chan Moldorm eek, when are they going to stop growing... Level: 143  Posts: 6974/12781 EXP: 35293588 For next: 538220 Since: 03-15-04 From: Nerima District, Tokyo - Japan Since last post: 12 hours Last activity: 12 hours |
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Originally posted by Krel The word 'reasonable' doesn |
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Zem You can be civil without being flowery, dipshits. Level: 49 Posts: 651/1107 EXP: 829398 For next: 54485 Since: 06-13-04 Since last post: 131 days Last activity: 131 days |
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Originally posted by Trapster |
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Colleen Administrator Level: 136 Posts: 6426/11302 EXP: 29369328 For next: 727587 Since: 03-15-04 From: LaSalle, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 3 hours Last activity: 1 hour |
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| I think any chance Tom might have had of retaining a staff spot on appeal was pretty much pissed away with how he's handled the discussion so far. There's the right way and the wrong way, and throwing out statements designed to turn people against one another isn't the right way. So as far as I'm concerned, the staff should stay as is at the moment not because of anything that's been said in the thread, but because of how things have been going down. Just a few quick thoughts before I head to school. Krel: I think it was a very bad call on your part to post the log, which was meant to be a private log in order that... and this is key... no bitching or anything of the short would happen. That being said, I'll agree with you on one point - people were going to be hurt by this. Like I said, if we took everyone's feelings into account, we'd have gone from a large staff to a bloated staff. That just can't work. Tom: Oh lord, where the hell do I begin... - Anya and Hiryuu having an affair? *laughs* God, I think that might beat some of Manda's lies right there. That's rich. - You're talking as if having 6 people discussing this was a bad thing. If we had opened it up to all 33 staff members, we'd NEVER get anything done. People would be fighting to keep their staff positions all of a sudden and you'd end up with some pretty bad blood regardless. The larger the group, the harder it is to meet because of time zones and other commitments; and Hiryuu had Acmlm's blessing to do this. He said several times that if Milly didn't approve of it or didn't come to the meeting, the whole deal was off. We weren't doing this without Acmlm being able to have a say or at the very least see what was going on. - Emuz has no reason to be "pissed" that Rydain was demoted. I haven't gotten that impression from him at all in the staff forums, and he has agreed on some of our points. - You're not "blowing the whistle" on me or anything; the fact that you've suddenly come up with the "Anya + Colleen + Hiryuu = clique" argument suggests to me that you're just trying to take as many people down with you as you can - which isn't going to happen. Furthermore, there's no reason for it to happen. Finally... The posting of the log, as I said, wasn't a good call because there was no reason to post it. It boggles my mind how we cannot keep ONE THING private on the board - and I'm referring to past instances as well here. Yeah ||bass, I'm pissed, but not for the reasons you might think. I'll stand by the comments I made in that log, but at the same time, posting it is NOT going to solve the problem and it is NOT going to stop the arguing. It's like throwing gasoline on the fire. With that said, I'm going to have a stiff drink and then head to school. Tom, if you want to talk about this REASONABLY without tossing untrue statements around, then you still have a window of opportunity to do so; but based on a lot of reactions seen in this thread, that window is closing pretty quickly. |
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Jesper Busy, busy, busy. Level: 69  Posts: 1758/2390 EXP: 2856000 For next: 13743 Since: 03-15-04 From: Sweden. Since last post: 176 days Last activity: 79 days |
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| In response to something Krel wrote, I'll quote something I wrote in the staff forum: "||bass has very right when he says that he's been fighting for the board when he helped with the move and setting up the development server. I salute him for doing it, absolutely, but it's not an excuse to take over the board. It wasn't for Erk and it won't be for ||bass." And if you don't think he's been trying to take over the board or atleast have an opinion on how the board should be run that's radically different from anyone else's and that won't be compatible in the long run, you haven't seen the right logs. It wasn't graceful, maybe it was better than Yiffy Kitten's reaction, but hell knows it wasn't graceful. [&||bass] the only reason i actually havent banned 100+ people by now is cause i know thered be retribution [&||bass] otherwise i would have [&||bass] including a good 1/3 of the staff [&||bass] its not just normal users [&||bass] theres moderators on every level i'd like to see banned but im not stupid enough to try it [&||bass] i'd also bring back the foreign language forum [&||bass] and ip ban anyone who writes a single non-english word outside that forum [&||bass] without warning [&||bass] what is this warning shit anyway [&||bass] you staffers know exactally what im talking about [&||bass] and dont lecture me about what it says in the faq [&||bass] i know what it says [&||bass] i wrote it [&||bass] its called ranting [&||bass] chances are 1 or 2 people actually ARE reading it [&||bass] just not typing [&||bass] xkeeper, interestingly enough, i wouldnt ban [&||bass] i'd just temp ban anyone who tried to have a conversation with him [&||bass] and when he complained, id say he had no grounds to complain cause he was never banned How many here agree with his policies? Exactly 0 people on the current staff do. It'd mean a board where you can't talk about everything. The whole point of this board is to talk about everything. |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1094/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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| Jesper, how in the name of god that proves that ||bass is trying to take over the board? Maybe he got a radical opinion, maybe he was just messing when he said those things. In the end, you'll never know, and if the satff demoted him based on those logs, i don't know what else you people are capable of. He pays for the damn DNS. He got rid of ErkDog. He GOT PMA access and he NEVER tried to attack the board as you say that he supposedly could. And after everything he done for the board, they backstab him. (no, not by demoting, but saying things like "IPban him" or "get rid of his PMA access") I'm really disappointed with those who went to that meeting. I'm done with this (i hope at least). kbye |
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Krel Goomba Level: 9 Posts: 13/22 EXP: 2227 For next: 935 Since: 07-24-04 Since last post: 5 hours Last activity: 64 days |
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| Hee, surely you can see that bass was joking in that quote, I mean come on [&||bass] xkeeper, interestingly enough, i wouldnt ban [&||bass] i'd just temp ban anyone who tried to have a conversation with him [&||bass] and when he complained, id say he had no grounds to complain cause he was never banned Funny as hell xD Need to maintain a sense of humor throughout these things, people, else there's nothing left. In response to Colleen, if you say there was no reason for the log to be posted, then that along isn't a good enough reason for the log not to be posted, hell, you could just say "The public has a right to know" and be done with that one xD Unless you're ashamed of what went on there, nothing's wrong. Hell, I posted the log just because people were confused about what was going on, that's all xD Let me reiterate, this issue is over and done with, Tom's offended but I know he's a good guy, he'll get over it, and he'll forgive people since he's been forgiven. I'm pleased with the maturity shown in this situation overall, with a few exceptions it's been quite surprisingly high. Relatively speaking, of course, none of us here is a saint xD |
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Jesper Busy, busy, busy. Level: 69 Posts: 1759/2390 EXP: 2856000 For next: 13743 Since: 03-15-04 From: Sweden. Since last post: 176 days Last activity: 79 days |
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Originally posted by knuckThis was the backlash. This was what kind of stuff he said after he found out the results, which if I know my laws of physics right can't ever be the reason he was demoted. And this is probably the mildest of that stuff. Originally posted by knuckErkDog was a prime example of how someone helping to pay for something isn't always the perfect person to have influence over it. I'm seeing the exact same tendencies here, because I know stuff you don't, I've seen stuff you don't, and there's about 20 more people with that kind of insight in staff, and none of them are complaining about this decision, in fact they agree with me. I've never said he'd go nuts and delete everyone. Of course he's capable of doing it. I'm capable of doing it. Doesn't mean I'll do it. I never claimed anything. Other people might have, but not me. If someone claimed anything, he did: [&||bass] the only reason i actually havent banned 100+ people by now is cause i know thered be retribution [&||bass] otherwise i would have [&||bass] including a good 1/3 of the staff [&||bass] its not just normal users Edit: Jizuko tells me that these particular chat quotes are from before the reconstruction, so part of my post may be moot now. But fear not, there's still lots of material of him freaking out afterwards. This isn't all unfounded now. (edited by Jesper on 01-27-05 09:42 AM) |
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Anya The Exile Ultima Mezcla de Yin Yan Level: 98  Posts: 4014/5337 EXP: 9530313 For next: 124040 Since: 03-15-04 From: South Florida Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| So you're saying Anya's affair with Hiryuu does not cause either one of them to support each other that much, to the point where anything one says, the other agrees with/does? Believe or not, but I really don't have a reason to lie, no it does not cause one or the other to think one way. Shit, this was about a year ago and since that time, we actually talk less (mainly due to me being busy in RL). And in fact, we only talked a few times and that was about the panel and when I could make it and if I had to work on said day. Shit, he wasn't even in IRC tha day. Just because two people are close, doesn't mean they won't disagree on issues. I'll still support him, yes, but if I don't agree with him then I won't agree with him. Simple as that. I'm getting a little tired of these 5 people at the meeting trying to pretend that demoting someone without notifying them first isn't incredibly disrespectful, offensive, and rude. It's been said before, but it hasn't apparently been listened to, so I'll say it again. How would you like it if you signed on one day to do your job (which you pay to do, not get paid to do, though that's beside the point) and found out that you were fired? This I totally agree with, and guess who got stuck sending out PMs to everyone. It was fun, I hated doing it, but it had to be done. Sure, it was done about five minutes, maybe ten, after the demotions, and I'm sorry for that, but PMs were sent out. ((damn, hit send before I was done)) I WANT PEOPLE TO SEE HOW THIS IS BULLSHIT. HOW THERE IS FAVORITISM PLAYED HERE. Funny. Let me say something here, and I will use Toxic as an example. Now, I wasn't all too thrilled about having Toxic as a LM at first. Then I saw first hand at the job that he does and was highly impressed. In fact, I wanted him as FM. Where is the favoritism in that? Yeah, all staff except the select few invited. And what do you mean, it wasn't just those three making the decisions, they were 60% of the decision making force there. Hiryuu wasn't in the IRC chat, I was fucking sick and going afk, and Colleen was there 100%. I chimed in when *I* wanted to. I could give a rat's ass to what the other two were saying, but in fact said what I wanted to say. But it seems that its hard for some people here to understand that. Oh, and there was a thread about this in the staff forum and in general chat, why didn't you say anything there? Why didn't you say that you wanted to be in on the chat? And if Emuz wasn't gonna put Rydain back, I was going to. As said so many times, and the staff can back me up on this, myself, Kas, and others wanted her back as an admin. And you know why that IRC log won't piss me off? Cause I have nothing to hide. Sure, it should have stayed with staff and ex-staff, but whatcha gonna do, right? Neko, please, make sense. PLEASE. NOBODY on EITHER side knows what the HELL you're talking about. I do. Trapster, we should really talk later. Well, thats all I'm gonna say here. For one, I just woke up, so I'm not 100% there myself yet, and In Taryn's drinks isn't helping me at all. In all honestly, nothing was meant to be personal and I'm sorry that feelings were hurt on both sides, during and after. (edited by Anya on 01-27-05 09:56 AM) (edited by Anya on 01-27-05 10:17 AM) |
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Jizuko Jiz Is The Magic! This board has run out of mana and can no longer use The Magic Level: 51  Posts: 1061/1191 EXP: 1004683 For next: 9255 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 230 days Last activity: 213 days |
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Originally posted by knuck Doman name services cost, for me, 21,31 USD a year. We've been here 10months, it should be getting time to pay for the new one. I can take over, seriously. 21$ is like, what, 3burgers less a year?  He got rid of ErkDog. And Erkdog did what? Added things to the board, payed for the whole hosting. Etc. See a pattern? He GOT PMA access and he NEVER tried to attack the board as you say that he supposedly could.Not directly attack, but indirectly missuse the power. Such as locking a thread from moderation and coding but never implementing (believe it was coded), a lock thread feature. Which negates all trust in local and fullmods we should have. And after everything he done for the board, they backstab him. (no, not by demoting, but saying things like "IPban him" or "get rid of his PMA access") And you are the master of knowing when things are serious or when people are joking. However, getting rid of PMA access is valid. Why demote someone when they can just, do whatever anyway? It's like just changing the color of an admin to blue, but they still have admin powers. Oh, and demanding power because you've donated or payed X amount reminds me of someone else. Geeze, I wish people would stop after some people started calming down. But no.  |
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Kwan Doesn't have a valid sized userpic. ||bass will be pissed :(((((((( Level: 50  Posts: 1067/1137 EXP: 937111 For next: 10206 Since: 03-15-04 From: Durkadurkastan! Since last post: 22 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| How about Colleen/Anya/Jizuko/Hiryuu and Yiffy Kitten/||bass/? get removed from the staff, and let's have an actual reconstruction? All this thread is doing is having a Red vs Blue nonsense, and whatever happens, in the end we'll have one sided staff, or a staff with a shitload of 'backstabbing' happening. We need some neutral people who can do their work and shut the fuck up. I'm all for a batch of fresh faces. (edited by Kwan on 01-27-05 12:13 PM) |
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Gavin Fuzzy Rhinoceruses don't play games. They fucking charge your ass. Level: 43  Posts: 429/799 EXP: 551711 For next: 13335 Since: 03-15-04 From: IL, USA Since last post: 13 hours Last activity: 13 hours |
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| that's the best idea i've heard yet. | |||
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kitty Come on babe, pet the pussy ;) Level: 70 Posts: 1256/2449 EXP: 2962406 For next: 53405 Since: 03-15-04 From: Scranton, PA, USA Since last post: 3 hours Last activity: 3 hours |
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Originally posted by KrelActually, it's more that I'll forgive people because I'm a sucker who is too trusting (of everyone).  And Anya: Don't lie and say you understand what the hell he said. Trapster made no sense. Everyone in IRC (despite which side they were on) clearly agreed. He's the perfect example of the blind, stupid type of user who will suck up to whoever is currently on staff. Kwan: That's what I thought "Staff reconstruction" MEANT. Not "One side of staff gradually eliminates anyone else who may disagree with their views" or "Demotes anyone remotely inactive" in the loosest sense of the word. EVERYONE is demoted and Acmlm promotes people as HE sees fit. Colleen: Yeah, I would've said the same thing, before this whole thing opened my eyes and let me see what a vengeful, immature person TJ is. Why was he put in charge? In a REAL staff reconstruction, wouldn't it be the admins and only the admins (And really, ONLY ACMLM) who makes the decisions, and all decisions? I mean, you're saying how 6 people is better because the other people they say to demote would want to keep their positions. Well, let's see what happened to these 6 people: Acmlm: Retained admin status (well DUH) Toxic: Promoted to FM Anya: Retained admin status Colleen: Retained admin status Kasumi: Retained FM status Ziff: Retained LM status Hiryuu (even though he wasnt in the chat): Retained FM status Surprising, hm? Oh yeah, they're active. But also, none of their "friends" were demoted, interestingly enough My point here, as I ALWAYS have to spell things out: Either invite everyone, or make Acmlm do it HIMSELF; you CANT have an effective decision made when current staffers who want to keep their positions are involved.Emuz has every reason and every right to be pissed. He thinks the same thing I do: This was gone about completely wrong. Not only were notices NOT given ahead of time, or were people who were facing demotion NOT confronted ahead of time with the case, but Acmlm did NOT have the final say on ANYTHING that happened. Show me where in that log, for example, he says ||bass or I should be demoted? Edit: Let me just say something on my OWN behalf for a change, since I'm not really defending myself, just my views: I don't really care, at this point, that I was demoted. It's a "Principle of the thing" issue. Yes, I'm upset, because I got the royal shaft. So perhaps it's hard for me to have an unbalanced opinion, or go about this without feeling certian biases towards some people. And, of course, I'm going to be upset at utter morons (Trapster) who make no sense whatsoever, or say things to deliberatley provoke me. I'm sorry if anyone not involved in this feels offended, and I don't want to personally offend most people who are currently on staff. In honesty, I don't want to offend ANYONE, I just want them to see why they're wrong; but telling someone they're wrong and showing why is almost certian to piss them off. (edited by Yiffy Kitten on 01-27-05 01:01 PM) |
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Gavin Fuzzy Rhinoceruses don't play games. They fucking charge your ass. Level: 43 Posts: 430/799 EXP: 551711 For next: 13335 Since: 03-15-04 From: IL, USA Since last post: 13 hours Last activity: 13 hours |
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Originally posted by Yiffy Kitten i think that is the reason why i did not think the results were satisfactory; i was expecting actual change. Instead of getting my hopes up, it should have just been labaled a Staff Re-sizing also the speed with witch the actual meetings themselves took place leave little room for a well planned and concerted decision. I believe it was only a disservice to yourselves to have executed the whole operation in one short session (at least that is as i understand it, correct me if i misunderstand the facts) (edited by Gavin on 01-27-05 01:08 PM) |
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Kitten Yiffer Purple wand Furry moderator Vivent l'exp����¯�¿�½������©rience de signalisation d'amusement, ou bien ! Level: 135 Posts: 7449/11162 EXP: 28824106 For next: 510899 Since: 03-15-04 From: Sweden Since last post: 3 hours Last activity: 4 min. |
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Originally posted by KwanLike the staff changes we had before? One one of them everyone was demoted expect for Acmlm. I think it was. And then people was voted on as a popularity poll, like a democracy of some sort. Or maybe I just got it wrong, I swear I saw some thread like that on the old board. I have no idea what it did lead to thought, since that board is so hellish slow that it takes severeal seconds to even generate a forum. I don't see the need personally for an such change.  |
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Ran-chan Moldorm eek, when are they going to stop growing... Level: 143 Posts: 6976/12781 EXP: 35293588 For next: 538220 Since: 03-15-04 From: Nerima District, Tokyo - Japan Since last post: 12 hours Last activity: 12 hours |
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Originally posted by Yiffy Kitten I |
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tuna ... Level: 3 Posts: 134/2 EXP: 51 For next: 77 Since: 12-02-04 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 1 day |
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Originally posted by KrelIf I had any sort of fucking power AT ALL I would ban you on the fucking spot. (edited by Alexa on 01-27-05 01:27 PM) |
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Kwan Doesn't have a valid sized userpic. ||bass will be pissed :(((((((( Level: 50 Posts: 1068/1137 EXP: 937111 For next: 10206 Since: 03-15-04 From: Durkadurkastan! Since last post: 22 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| Stop with the flaming. *gets popcorn* Continue. Oh and XK's abuse of Don't #5, You had admin when you hacked the board. |
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Gavin Fuzzy Rhinoceruses don't play games. They fucking charge your ass. Level: 43 Posts: 431/799 EXP: 551711 For next: 13335 Since: 03-15-04 From: IL, USA Since last post: 13 hours Last activity: 13 hours |
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Originally posted by TrapsterOriginally posted by Yiffy Kitten |
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