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1 user currently in Super Mario World hacking:  labmaster |
| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - Super Mario World hacking - Like it or not, here comes a recovery tool for locked ROMs. |
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Squash Monster New Age Retro Hippie Togateiru Fohku Kohgeki!! GRUNGE no HAMSTER otona bite Peace love and turnpike! Level: 40 Posts: 503/677 EXP: 430507 For next: 10802 Since: 03-15-04 From: Maryland (of the Country Between Canada and Mexico) Since last post: 5 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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| From what I've seen, there are two complaints: 1.) "I can't hide secrets anymore" 2.) "They'll steal my work" To the first: if someone goes to the trouble of stopping the game, unlocking your hack, opening it up in Lunar Magic, finding the level, and examining it for whatever hidden walls or obscure floating platforms or random bits of terrain that look like pipes or what-have-you that you've used to hide the solution, then you've already failed as a game designer. No player should ever have to feel so lost that they'll spend anywhere from five minutes to half an hour cheating to find their way. This community relies too much on so-called "puzzles" that consist of deciding to do one random thing with no hints towards it; players will not waste their time cheating if your game is properly designed and they know what to do. To the second: so what if someone starts building their hack off of yours? Either they do a poor job, everyone can see that they stole from you, and the credit stays yours, or they do a very good job, and no one can recognize it, which makes the credit rightfully belong to them anyway. Let's use Fu's SMB3 pipes as an example, since there isn't any danger of stealing those any time soon: the only way someone could get credit for using those pipes would be to use them much better than Fu already did. And if someone can do that, they shouldn't be punished. Good job Parasyte. |
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco.  Level: 114  Posts: 4494/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by Squash MonsterSecrets do not necessarily need to be found in order to go on. I have a few extra-secret levels that are supposed to be just rewards for the player playing a lot and stumbing upon them, for instance, but they can be easily found just be looking at the overworld in LM =/ (edited by Kyouji Craw on 01-14-05 08:12 PM) (edited by Kyouji Craw on 01-14-05 08:14 PM) |
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Imajin Buster Beetle Level: 34  Posts: 404/452 EXP: 234863 For next: 18788 Since: 03-15-04 From: Kingdom of Zeal Since last post: 39 days Last activity: 53 days |
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Originally posted by Kyouji CrawOriginally posted by Squash MonsterSecrets do not necessarily need to be found in order to go on. I have a few extra-secret levels that are supposed to be just rewards for the player playing a lot and stumbing upon them, for instance, but they can be easily found just be looking at the overworld in LM =/ Well, it's they who are losing out on the fun of finding secrets, aren't they? I know I, for one, never would go into LM (or other editors) to look for things I couldn't find, even in unlocked hacks/hacks of games without lock functions.. If a person wants to cheat, they're going to find a way, but if they simply want to play the hack correctly, they'll do that. |
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Luigi-San Melon Bug Level: 42 Posts: 132/736 EXP: 485962 For next: 35400 Since: 03-20-04 From: Mushroom Kingdom Since last post: 17 hours Last activity: 10 hours |
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Grrr.....  I'm getting this at the command prompt: "< was unexpected at this time" WTF? Edit: Never Mind (edited by Luigi-San on 01-14-05 09:00 PM) |
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UnsurpassedDarkness Melon Bug Level: 39 Posts: 295/746 EXP: 391555 For next: 13216 Since: 10-29-04 From: Λtlantıs. All your base are belong to us. Since last post: 12 days Last activity: 2 days |
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When I try to open this, nothing happens. |
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jmr Paratroopa Level: 21  Posts: 81/149 EXP: 44421 For next: 5522 Since: 03-16-04 From: Newfoundland, Canada (aka the middle of FRICKIN' nowhere) Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 3 days |
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| Just adding my two cents: [RANT] First of all: Great work Parasyte. Second: I can see how some of you are worried about your level secrets being revealed, or elements of your hack being stolen. Regarding the level secrets: so what? Unless the person blabs the secrets around, I think it's really no big deal. It will only affect the gaming experience for that one person. And for the stealing: yeah, it's now definitly a possibility. But I really hope that we, and any future rom hacker, will have the sensability NOT take someone else's work and call it their own. It's plagiarism. And we learn (or should have learned) at a very young age that plagiarism is wrong. And if it does happen, well, I guess we can just do our best to watch for such activities, and attempt to prevent them before they get out of hand. Remember now, it's not really Parasyte's fault if the stealing occurs. He may have provided a tool that can be used for illegitimate purposes, but it also can have perfectly legitimate uses as well. A LOT of programs are like that... one example is CD Backup software. The software can be used exclusivly for backups, yet some people will use it to make illegitimate copies. It's not the software or the creator of the software that's to blame, I feel the blame should fall on the people using it for the illegitimate purposes. [/RANT] I personally don't plan on using this to reveal secrets of a hack or steal . I will keep it in case of an accidental locked hack. Mind you, I'll still keep a backup. |
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Parasyte Bullet Bill Level: 35  Posts: 192/514 EXP: 267348 For next: 12588 Since: 05-25-04 Since last post: 104 days Last activity: 32 days |
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| That's because it's not a GUI-based application. I find it difficult to believe anyone disapproves of RLM, concidering most of the people who would abuse it have no idea what a command line program is. :\ |
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Karadur Fire Snake  Level: 48  Posts: 587/1192 EXP: 786444 For next: 37099 Since: 11-02-04 From: Chatham, Ontario, Canada Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 15 hours |
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Originally posted by UnsurpassedDarkness What OS are you using? I'm running XP, and here's what I did. Have the rlm.exe file, and the ROM you want to unlock on your desktop. Make sure the ROM filename has no spaces in it. Click 'Start'->'Run', and in the box that pops up, type 'cmd'. That will open a command prompt, which should show stuff about which version of Windows you're running at the top, then this line: c:\Documents and Settings\[username]> Type 'cd Desktop', press enter, then put in rlm [locked ROM filename].smc [filename to save unlocked ROM as].smc (without the square brackets). Hit enter, and it should go through unlocking the ROM, and create another file on your desktop, which is the unlocked version of the ROM. Open that in Lunar Magic, and you're set for whatever you want to do. I hope no one gets angry with me for explaining that  It's pretty much just a more detailed version of the 'Using RLM' section in the readme.As far as the actual release of this, I'll say nice work on it  There's obvious issues with it, as other people have pointed out, but my whole opinion on this is, if someone unlocks your ROM, and uses it to find secrets in the game / steal your graphics / whatever else, it's their loss.If they use it to find secrets, or even get through levels easier, it'll take most of the fun of figuring out things on your own away. If someone wants to steal your graphics or base their hack off of what you've done, then they're only hurting themselves once again. First off, they won't figure out how to add graphics in the game the right way, which would definitely present a roadblock if they wanted to add something else to your work, and I think it'd also be fairly obvious if someone stole what you did. Personally, I think that all this program does is make it easier to get into a locked ROM. Even if this program didn't exist, it wouldn't make it any harder for someone with the time and knowledge to be able to unlock a ROM. Sure, the feeling might still be the same even to someone who unlocked it manually, but it's still the same thing in the end  Take that for what you will, as it's just my opinion  (edited by Karadur on 01-14-05 09:42 PM) |
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UnsurpassedDarkness Melon Bug Level: 39 Posts: 298/746 EXP: 391555 For next: 13216 Since: 10-29-04 From: Λtlantıs. All your base are belong to us. Since last post: 12 days Last activity: 2 days |
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That worked, thanks. I hate programs without a GUI. |
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Lenophis Super Koopa Level: 44  Posts: 315/830 EXP: 584360 For next: 26925 Since: 03-15-04 From: Duluth, MN Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 3 hours |
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Originally posted by Kyouji CrawOriginally posted by Squash MonsterSecrets do not necessarily need to be found in order to go on. I have a few extra-secret levels that are supposed to be just rewards for the player playing a lot and stumbing upon them, for instance, but they can be easily found just be looking at the overworld in LM =/ You argument fails. Ever since the creation of the "walkthru," secrets have been impossible to hide. Ever since the creation of the Game Genie, people abuse the system to their liking. All you can do is hope for the best. There's no way around it. Because of these two things, nothing is sacred or hidden in a game. I would stop being an elitist if I were you, and accept reality, which is "people suck." Besides, how do you think Nintendo, Square, Sony, etc feel when they put 2 years of a full staff into a game, just to be cracked open within the first 10 minutes... (edited by Lenophis on 01-14-05 10:58 PM) |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1038/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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| With this program i'll unlock my hack that have been locked for 2 years. And you people say that it's bad because people will steal your stuff? Because of stuff like that so many people hate the smw hacking "community".  Awesome program! Thanks again Parasyte. (edited by knuck on 01-15-05 02:53 AM) |
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco. Level: 114 Posts: 4497/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by LenophisWait. I'm an elitist? I'm not an elitist. I think this thing is GOOD, I'm merely concerned about one of the many things this could do. Also, walkthroughs for hacks are almost nonexistant, so your argument kinda fails there. Plus, it takes a big company much less time to create something than it does an individual person, because the person doesn't have as much time to work on it and also doesn't have a huge support team backing them up, so... EDIT: Oh and knuck, only one or two people have said they're worried about people stealing stuff. No one important really cares about it. (edited by Kyouji Craw on 01-15-05 03:08 AM) |
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Lenophis Super Koopa Level: 44 Posts: 317/830 EXP: 584360 For next: 26925 Since: 03-15-04 From: Duluth, MN Since last post: 4 hours Last activity: 3 hours |
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Originally posted by Kyouji Craw I was talking about all games in general, not just hacks.
How does that change what I said? 2 years+ of work is still 2 years+ of work. Doesn't matter how many are on said project, or who is backing them. (edited by Lenophis on 01-15-05 03:31 AM) |
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Glyph Phoenix Level: 39  Posts: 30/745 EXP: 385876 For next: 18895 Since: 11-07-04 Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| This is insane. How can you people hack a game and then be offended when someone hacks yours? And Kyouji Craw,you're offended by what someone else wrote? Do you read your own posts? If someone can unlock your hack, deal with it. You can't stop them. It's not like we won't know if some lamer goes and rips your work. And as Squash Monster said, if they do such a good job that you can no longer tell that it's yours, then they're probably talented enough to steal your work anyway. If you get offended by someone using base material to make a better piece of work, then I guess SMO was a waste of BMF's time, wasn't it? And how you can defend yourself by saying that you're only one person and Nintendo is a company is perplexing. It is still a matter of stealing original work, is it not? And there are hack walkthroughs, I don't understand how someone can make that argument while being an active memberr of this forum. And even if there aren't formal walkthroughs, you can always ask someone who's beaten the game for help. The fact that some people can believe that this tool is going to cause so many problems boggles the mind. And on the subject of secrets, someone's bound to figure them out and spill the beans unless you designed the secret so poorly that no one will ever find it. I, for one, am going to use this tool to hack SMO sometime in the future and use it as a learning tool. And the only way anyone can really stop me is by asking nicely, correct? Even if I were to steal from it, there's not much anyone can do about that either. And if I choose to go ahead anyway even if BMF didn't want me to, well, sucks to be him. There's not really anything that he can do about it. (This is an example, if BMF asks me not to unlock it I won't. And I certainly don't plan to steal from it.) Even if Parasyte were to suddenly change his mind and recall this tool, it's not like hacks won't be hacked. In conclusion, stop whining, ya hypocrites. |
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Rain Man Buzzy Beetle Level: 31 Posts: 284/378 EXP: 175079 For next: 10284 Since: 04-14-04 Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 16 hours |
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| I agree with Glyph Pheonix. If I lock my hack and havent made a backup, i can restore it, and I WILL use the program as a learning tool. It will help me become a greater hacker but I WILL NOT rip ExGFX. On a side note, so far this program is pointless. If it corrupts the overworld upon restoring, then if you restore your hack you will have a corrupt overworld and you cant fix it!!!!! What the hell is the point of that? |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1039/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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| To restore levels maybe? My hack had no overworld, so i have nothing to worry about.  |
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Rain Man Buzzy Beetle Level: 31 Posts: 286/378 EXP: 175079 For next: 10284 Since: 04-14-04 Since last post: 5 days Last activity: 16 hours |
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True, but what about the people who have edited their overworld like me? Theres no hope  |
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knuck Hinox Banned until 19-58-5815: trolling, flaming, spamming, being a general fucktard... Level: 62 Posts: 1041/1818 EXP: 1894574 For next: 90112 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 14 hours Last activity: 9 hours |
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Originally posted by CrUnChY NUtMaybe, just MAYBE, you could WAIT for a POSSIBLE new version or bug fix. Also just fyi, LM protection doesn't protect the overworld. If you have it, you can use jonwil's overworld editor and try to save it to a new rom. I'm not sure if it's possible, but you can try. |
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||bass Programmer Admin Level: 44  Posts: 171/817 EXP: 570813 For next: 40472 Since: 03-15-04 From: Salem, Connecticut Since last post: 26 days Last activity: 11 days |
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Originally posted by CrUnChY NUtThe program doesn't corrupt the overworld. The overworld gets encoded by the origional protection... this program simply doesn't decode it. |
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cpubasic13 17 years old now. Time to buy some M rated games by myself! Level: 54  Posts: 818/1346 EXP: 1206934 For next: 26936 Since: 03-15-04 From: Blame my parents, Eddy Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 1 day |
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Originally posted by Parasyte First off, DD's Mario's Adventure was a good hack, but now if I see his hacks, I really don't care for them anymore. I don't care if he changes the engine. He could do it because he knows every freaking little thing about SMB3. You get him to hack SMW and he won't be adding in complex ASM hacks anytime soon. You get what I am saying? Everyone can do this when you know it all. You all seem amazed when someone makes a small ASM hack. Woop de doo. I can do a small ASM hack. You could do a small ASM hack. ANYONE CAN! The only difference between them and the ones who don't know ASM is that they know the data for the game and everyone else knows diddly squat about the game they are hacking. You all need to face the facts: everyone here is a rom hacker. If they know ASM, they are a rom hacker. If they can only edit graphics, they are still a rom hacker. If they hack SMW, they are a romm hacker. You know what, flame me and whatever because I don't really care, but some of you "Professional ASM Hackers" think you are so much better than the rest of us. You are not. You just happen to know more data than the rest of us. If we had more data, then of course we could do better ASM hacks. So quit boasting. Note: I am not saying all ASM hackers are this way. Some of these people however just brag about it too much. Note 2: This is just my opinion. If you guys want to argue it, go ahead. I am sure you will defend you or someone else... but I am not trying to make enemies here. I would prefer it if we all just got along better. For the program now... it is nice for recovery and seeing how complex some tiles were arranged, but if I wanted to take the graphics or take the levels, I would ask first. Still, the program is nifty and worth getting for some things. Good work with that. And on another note, if you want DW:TLC unlocked, ask Fu first before doing so. Besides, you can't just open LM and see the ASM code for the pipes. You would still have to look in a hex editor. |
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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - Super Mario World hacking - Like it or not, here comes a recovery tool for locked ROMs. |
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