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2 users currently in General Chat:  Dark Vampriel |
| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - General Chat - Ethics: Is an animal’s life worth a human’s? |
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco.  Level: 114  Posts: 1571/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| ... Dorkus isn't a word, it's just what I say when I nothing really fits the situation, but my target has done something stupid. Anyway, I don't have any links to the studies, as I don't know where to find them online. They were on paper. A better question is, why do you think animals don't have souls? Seriously, why? Anyway, a soul is a spirit given by God. I'm not religionless, but I fail to see how any religion, skewed as it may be, could teach that animals do not have souls. Perhaps if they acted only on instinct, but animals can learn, and can be domesticated. This alone should be proof enough that that's not true. (edited by Kyouji Craw on 07-07-04 08:43 PM) |
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DarkSlaya POOOOOOOOOOOORN! Level: 88 Posts: 404/4249 EXP: 6409254 For next: 241410 Since: 05-16-04 From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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| When I first view this thread, I didn't think this would be such an offensive matter. It's that close to begin a flame war. Edit: On another note... w00t! post #404! (edited by DarkSlaya on 07-07-04 08:49 PM) |
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco. Level: 114 Posts: 1574/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Oh, I don't believe a flame war will result, though there will be much discussion. | |||
Prier Archangel Administrative Priestess. NUCLEAR SUB WEEEOOOO Level: 119  Posts: 1952/8392 EXP: 18790939 For next: 138352 Since: 03-15-04 From: Nerima Dist. - Tokyo, Japan Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 1 day |
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Originally posted by DarkSlaya' Ethics/Religion in general is extremely touchy. Especially for those that are serious in the matter. That said it BETTER NOT erupt into one... |
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DarkSlaya POOOOOOOOOOOORN! Level: 88 Posts: 405/4249 EXP: 6409254 For next: 241410 Since: 05-16-04 From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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Originally posted by RankoOriginally posted by DarkSlaya' That's pretty much why I stopped giving my opinion in this thread. (edited by DarkSlaya on 07-07-04 08:56 PM) (edited by DarkSlaya on 07-07-04 09:12 PM) |
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Jagori Flurry Level: 27 Posts: 96/267 EXP: 103625 For next: 12534 Since: 04-17-04 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 2 hours |
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| If a creature isn't self-aware and is biting me or something, like a mosquito, I'll kill it. If it's not bothering me, I'll ignore it. The only sentient creatures I can really bring myself to kill are fish; Hunting, I could never pull the trigger, and I go out of my way to save animals in trouble. I hope I'm never faced with the question in the original post, because I'd take so long to decide that both would drown.. or I'd go and save the person because they're the same species as me and instinct would decide for me. However, this all changes if you're away from civilization. Out there, no one creature's life has any more value to nature than another's, and ethics mean nothing when you're not around other people. The whole question of whether or not people are superior depends on whose field you're playing on, and consequently, this topic could arguably be divided into two sections. In New York, for example, humans are definitely dominant, and need to take responsibility on a larger scale for their actions - hence the question of ethics. Now take the Congo area... the same set of 'ethics' would get you eaten. In pure nature, humans are physically at a huge disadvantage being much weaker, slower, etc. than many predators. One-on-one, no technology to give us a major advantage... I'd have no problem killing a cougar with a knife if I was somehow able to. The 'ethics' here are on a much smaller scale - instead of "What should I do to make life better for everyone?" it's "What should I do so that my friend and I can stay alive?" (edited by Jagori on 07-07-04 08:52 PM) (edited by Jagori on 07-07-04 08:57 PM) |
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Prier Archangel Administrative Priestess. NUCLEAR SUB WEEEOOOO Level: 119 Posts: 1953/8392 EXP: 18790939 For next: 138352 Since: 03-15-04 From: Nerima Dist. - Tokyo, Japan Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 1 day |
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| Simple answer, Darkslaya, don't post in thread. | |||
Apple Kodondo Level: 38 Posts: 106/594 EXP: 350163 For next: 20284 Since: 03-27-04 From: Washington. Since last post: 264 days Last activity: 152 days |
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| Do animals not feel, experince emotions, or have have families? An animal's life means just as much as mine and yours. However, being a human. I value my kind more than I value an animals. They don't mean anyless to me, I just don't see them as being as important than a humans. |
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco. Level: 114 Posts: 1577/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Now there's an answer I can understand (and accept as logical). You don't think of them as being worth any less, but, you would rather save one of your own kind. Sure, it's a little basic, but feh. | |||
Silvershield Slime Level: 30 Posts: 283/345 EXP: 153029 For next: 12840 Since: 04-11-04 From: New Jersey Since last post: 60 days Last activity: 6 hours |
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| I've always rejected the notion of dragging some dictionary definition into an argument to prove a point, but if you like that sort of thing, dictionary.com offers a description of a soul as an exclusively human possession. But, avoiding that, I argue that any given animal lacks a soul because of my personal set of beliefs, no more. The soul is not a tangible object whose presence can be proven or disproven, so this discussion will continue as a stalement at worst, perhaps an enlightening sharing of ideas at best. I will say, however, that I am no animal hater. I'm not an animal lover in the common sense of the term, though I'd question that label in the first place; you are no animal lover if you like cute, cuddly animals, but have no such feelings for the big and ugly ones. Most mammals are wired to protect a small, adorable animal, same species or not. Jagori, we argue not who would win in a contest of strength or speed, but which life has more value. Humans are outshined in nearly every aspect of physical prowess by some lifeform or another, yet I still hold that the life of a person is of supreme value. |
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Jagori Flurry Level: 27 Posts: 97/267 EXP: 103625 For next: 12534 Since: 04-17-04 Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by Silvershield I follow what you're saying, and I don't mean that animals are more valuable than humans because they can outrun them. I just meant that as far as nature itself is concerned, humans are no more valuable than lions, or catfish, or any other animal. Like I said (although in a late edit), I'd save the person because they're the same species as me and that instinctively makes them more important to me. I don't care to thoroughly review my ideas to find out WHY they're more important to me beyond that. |
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Silvershield Slime Level: 30 Posts: 285/345 EXP: 153029 For next: 12840 Since: 04-11-04 From: New Jersey Since last post: 60 days Last activity: 6 hours |
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Originally posted by JagoriThat's a good point, and I think I restated it (to a degree) in a previous post - we are indeed no greater than animals from a purely biological angle, though our mental capacities clearly distinguish us. |
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BookReader Ninji Level: 25  Posts: 143/232 EXP: 86317 For next: 3303 Since: 03-15-04 From: Albuquerque, New Mexico (Land of Disenchantment) Since last post: 22 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| Actually I | |||
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco. Level: 114 Posts: 1578/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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Originally posted by SilvershieldAnd like I said, several studies indicate that dolphins are as smart or smarter than us. Hell, even dogs show the ability to learn a human language and respond to it, even if they can't speak it. |
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Apple Kodondo Level: 38 Posts: 113/594 EXP: 350163 For next: 20284 Since: 03-27-04 From: Washington. Since last post: 264 days Last activity: 152 days |
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| Humans aren | |||
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BookReader Ninji Level: 25 Posts: 147/232 EXP: 86317 For next: 3303 Since: 03-15-04 From: Albuquerque, New Mexico (Land of Disenchantment) Since last post: 22 days Last activity: 2 days |
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| Well hey, don | |||
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DarkSlaya POOOOOOOOOOOORN! Level: 88 Posts: 424/4249 EXP: 6409254 For next: 241410 Since: 05-16-04 From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada Since last post: 8 hours Last activity: 5 hours |
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Originally posted by BookReader |
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Alastor the Stylish Hey! I made a cool game! It's called "I poisoned half the food, so if you eat you might die!" Have a taco. Level: 114 Posts: 1595/7620 EXP: 16258468 For next: 51099 Since: 03-15-04 From: Oregon, US Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| It shouldn't v_v Every male of every species (of the higher-level intelligences) think the same thing about the females of their species. | |||
RoboticParanoia Cheep-cheep Level: 23  Posts: 69/184 EXP: 60582 For next: 7141 Since: 03-23-04 From: Texas Since last post: 150 days Last activity: 150 days |
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| I won't kill anything with a brain. I'd eat them, but I won't kill them, myself. If that's hypocrisy, I dunno. But it's true, for me at least. | |||
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BookReader Ninji Level: 25 Posts: 148/232 EXP: 86317 For next: 3303 Since: 03-15-04 From: Albuquerque, New Mexico (Land of Disenchantment) Since last post: 22 days Last activity: 2 days |
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Originally posted by RoboticParanoia You know, I don't know if animals have souls or not, but if anyone thought robots did... (It's a joke dammit) |
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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - General Chat - Ethics: Is an animal’s life worth a human’s? |
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