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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - International Women's Day |
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Andrew Level: 11  Posts: 44/48 EXP: 5621 For next: 364 Since: 01-20-05 From: Sexopolis. Since last post: 235 days Last activity: 209 days |
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| On March 1st, real men celebrate Wang Day, a beautiful tribute to majority rule the world over. | |||
windwaker Ball and Chain Trooper WHY ALL THE MAYONNAISE HATE Level: 61  Posts: 1287/1797 EXP: 1860597 For next: 15999 Since: 03-15-04 Since last post: 4 days Last activity: 6 days |
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Originally posted by Andrew ... what? I think that there will never be true gender equality, but it's possible to exist in our government. Hell, stop saying women, men, gays, blacks, etc. have different rights, and our government will start shaping up. There will never be true equality in this area, because men and women are different physically, and mentally. I don't think there should be drastic changes in law because of this, though. I mean, women aren't forced to raise their children, but in this society, they are expected to. What's up with that?  |
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hhallahh Bob-Omb Level: 38  Posts: 516/607 EXP: 365476 For next: 4971 Since: 03-15-04 From: Portland, OR Since last post: 73 days Last activity: 60 days |
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Originally posted by The SomerZ I have a better idea about legislated maternity/paternity leave that would result in equality: Abolish it. Let firms create their own policies, and let those who don't like them work at other firms. It'd work in Norway, or America, or anywhere, and it'd just be great. The implicit fear is that women will be punished for having children (or maybe men would too, if paternity leave becomes common), but.. my response would be is that, if you're planning on having children, this is simply a factor you should take into account. As for subsidizing child care.. the reason why women quit their jobs to be with their children is because they could do spend their time better by investing in their homes. Artificially lowering the opportunity cost of going to work results in the destruction of wealth so that feminists can feel better when looking at societal statistics. Silly. (edited by hhallahh on 03-11-05 03:06 PM) |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99  Posts: 3207/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| hhallahh, it seems that you are putting money in front of women and the plight that faces them upon their maternal struggles. Point 1: Mother, single, young, uneducated. Your ideas are basically giving her a slap in the face. You're putting an impossible scenario for her to deal with in the air. Unfortunately, you're trying to drive this thread into some sort of privatization debate. No dice. |
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hhallahh Bob-Omb Level: 38 Posts: 517/607 EXP: 365476 For next: 4971 Since: 03-15-04 From: Portland, OR Since last post: 73 days Last activity: 60 days |
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| No, if it's about equal rights for women, then "privatization" is a perfectly legitimate means to achieve this end. If it's about equal results for women, then yes.. that's ridiculous. To argue that the wage gap should be proactively dealt with while ignoring its true causes is ridiculous in the way that arguing that a McDonalds employee should earn the same amount of money as a doctor is ridiculous. "Uneducated, single, young mothers" are the typical strawman example, one that I wouldn't argue with. I think the rates of paternity debts that are actually collected are appalling. As a result, we have various programs aimed at helping "uneducated, single, young mothers". I wouldn't oppose these (at least not here.) However, we're not just talking about women who fall into that catagory, are we? Or we're not talking about remedies tailored to their specific problems, are we? |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 3210/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| How does it achieve these ends? Please, enlighten me. And guess what isn't a strawman example? Under educated single young mothers! You know why? Because all of your arguments are pointing to that. Of course, on your quest for morals and equality through that psuedo-quack science of economics (put down the Ayn Rand and breath a little bit, I have something to tell you, objectivism is complete crap) you are hurting people by making vast inequalities. |
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hhallahh Bob-Omb Level: 38 Posts: 518/607 EXP: 365476 For next: 4971 Since: 03-15-04 From: Portland, OR Since last post: 73 days Last activity: 60 days |
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| Wow, you're attacking economics as an empirical discipline? I dare say rational argument is probably not worth having with you, but I'll add the obvious point: If the law is blind to gender differences, then both men and women have equal rights, at least in the negative sense through which most people use the term. Simple. | |||
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 3212/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Equal rights in writing doesn't mean equal rights in practise. Martin Luther King, Jr. and other civil rights workers fought for this simple fact. (and that "irrational" argument shut you up about economics, so I'm thinking that it worked the way I wanted it to) |
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Steak Zora Level: 35  Posts: 362/507 EXP: 278751 For next: 1185 Since: 03-16-04 From: Ohio University Since last post: 195 days Last activity: 195 days |
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| Privitization will not help this matter. Privitization is a cornerstone of capitalism...which by and large (if we've payed any attention in our lives, we would notice this) is designed to and deftfully does cater to the well-to-do and the wealthy. If the wealthy in this country (and likely in others) wants something, it will ultimately happen. Legal or not (I don't consider jumping through a loophole a legal act). As to the social science of economics...if we can have people twist the text that expressly commands "Love thy neighboor as thy brother" (a clear, direct order from the Messiah) into the Bible giving reasons to support slavery...I wouldn't be surprised if some can twist hard numbers into meaning somthing else. |
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Andrew Level: 11 Posts: 47/48 EXP: 5621 For next: 364 Since: 01-20-05 From: Sexopolis. Since last post: 235 days Last activity: 209 days |
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| Women pretty much have it better than ever in America today. You know why women will never be on a completely equal footing with men, though? Things like this are why. It's impossible, these days, for anyone to say fucking anything that anyone might construe as a disparaging remark. To suggest -- GOD FORBID! -- that men and women are wired differently got the president of Harvard fucking blasted by women's groups and the media. This doesn't make us, as males, feel all warm and happy towards women -- rather, it makes us feel resentment for the bunch of fucking feminist bitches who think they're doing someone a favor by complaining when they have nothing to complain about. I say, as long as people bitch and moan about every little thing that doesn't go their way, they don't deserve to be on an equal footing. Maybe if women took some more fucking responsibility for their positions in life, they'd have less inequality to bitch about. And, yes, some do. But many others seem to think that, instead of self-improvement and learning to do their jobs better, they can go and hold protests and give out press releases and magically someone will begin seeing them for the beautiful, unique snowflake that they are. Fuck that. I have no sympathy. (edited by Andrew on 03-12-05 06:45 AM) |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 3222/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| Andrew: The President of Harvard has had a really mean streak with his remarks against women. Even before he got the job ACLU raised an eyebrow and didn't want to defend him when he stated that women should be in the kitchen. Not in school. That men should discipline them, etc. This is his most benign comment, but it is the one that broke the camel's back. | |||
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Kasumi-Astra Administrator Level: 62  Posts: 1287/1867 EXP: 1971846 For next: 12840 Since: 03-15-04 From: Reading, UK Uni: Sheffield, UK Since last post: 1 day Last activity: 12 hours |
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| If half of Men discovered how similar women really are to men, then violence would stop. I strongly feel that anonymity between the sexes and a lack of understanding of each other's issues is what is causing further anger. Girls and boys should be taught together in sex ed at school, and overall I believe that the whole teaching of sex ed should be compulsory and comprehensive. Any school that does not teach children these issues is doing an injustice to them. |
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hhallahh Bob-Omb Level: 38 Posts: 520/607 EXP: 365476 For next: 4971 Since: 03-15-04 From: Portland, OR Since last post: 73 days Last activity: 60 days |
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Originally posted by Ziffski Link plz. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 3243/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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| He did it to express "free-speech" and the only schools that really accept him are the business schools and other schools at Harvard that are somewhat well known for being "boys only" clubs. Still...I suppose that "free speech" entails going out and yelling in the face of a Jew that the Holocaust was funny...sure! http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/022205P.shtml This article doesn't go in depth into his previous things. But I am glad that he has made amends to what he did. Of course, his previous comments were made while Cornel was prez of Harvard and he was a professeur. |
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Kario In Possession of a Stolen Shovel Level: 65 Posts: 1459/2082 EXP: 2321379 For next: 14249 Since: 03-15-04 From: Texas... Yeehaw! Since last post: 2 days Last activity: 17 hours |
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| Oh goody, I guess I am the only one on the board against equal rights for genders aren't I.... | |||
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hhallahh Bob-Omb Level: 38 Posts: 521/607 EXP: 365476 For next: 4971 Since: 03-15-04 From: Portland, OR Since last post: 73 days Last activity: 60 days |
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Originally posted by Ziffski Um, I wanted links to where he allegedly said that women belonged in the kitchen and "men should discipline them". Unless I didn't read closely enough, it's not in here. |
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alte Hexe Star Mario I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night Alive as you and me "But Joe you're ten years dead!" "I never died" said he "I never died!" said he Level: 99 Posts: 3245/5458 EXP: 9854489 For next: 145511 Since: 03-15-04 From: ... Since last post: 2 hours Last activity: 2 hours |
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I don't have those links available to me currently. I had heard this second hand through people that follow the women's liberation movement very carefully and the (what I suppose misogynists like you) would call "cells" on campuses around the big schools of America.  Edit:: Thinking on it...It might have been Cornel or one fo the former presidents. I'm not too sure right now. (edited by Ziffski on 03-13-05 03:24 PM) |
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hhallahh Bob-Omb Level: 38 Posts: 522/607 EXP: 365476 For next: 4971 Since: 03-15-04 From: Portland, OR Since last post: 73 days Last activity: 60 days |
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| Um, I'm not a "misogynist". You're not going to win any arguments by being intellectually dishonest and posing false dilemmas. And I really don't think Summers said that. Since you're apparently unable to provide evidence otherwise, I'll continue to think that. Nothing I've read about Summers evidences at a misogynistic streak on his part. |
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Jei*376 Micro-Goomba Level: 6 Posts: 11/13 EXP: 744 For next: 163 Since: 02-22-05 Since last post: 173 days Last activity: 173 days |
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| Sorry to bump this thread but since the information is of current status and not outdated like old SMW hacks or questions I figured I could post to it with my 'misogynist' views. Firstly, however, I am NOT and NEVER WILL BE a misogynist. Having said that, I am Anti-Feminist to the bone. You won't find more an anti-Feminist or Anti-Liberal period, more anti than myself. Having said that, let's do this! I believe equal pay is for women who deserve it. Too many times I see women complain that the only jobs in the paper are for men. Well, to the women who wanna be treated and paid like a man this is for youa nd dedicated to you - There is your golden oppurtunity, Betty Boop! Show your moxy and get money! If you apply for a Warehouse who pays secretaries $7.50/hour and Truck Loaders $12.00/hour, don't bitch! You are not the ones lifting those 50-100 Lbs boxes repetetively. You lift a pen, a phone and a cup of coffee for your boss. Really hard work there. You are not the one breaking your back everyday for 8-12 hours of hard labor. The only thing you broke in your day today is a nail when you picked up the phone the wrong way. You're not wheeling heavy freight from one end of the plant to another constantly while your legs, back and feet are killing you in the heat of the warehouse. Oh, no you are busy wheeling your lazy ass in your comfortable office wheelie chair from the desk to the file cabinet in your nice, air-conditioned room, with the comfort of sitting down all day and standing to stretch as needed. As if getting up to do what you do sliding along the floor is so much for you to do that you can't unglue your ass from your chair. You don't have the loud crashing of materials falling to the floor or the loud sounds of machine blaring in your ears. You are behind sound-proof walls with Soft Rock playing on the Muzak to ease your mind. You don't have to fear losing a finger or toe or eye from a machine.In fact the only thing you can really lose is the boss' car keys when he asks for them. You don't have to fear chemical spills and burns on your side of the plant. youa re safe from that, in fact, your worst spills and burns come when you trip and spill the boss' coffeee all over, some on you! You aren't the one starving your butt off and dying of thirst with no reprieve til break by reason of all the work you are doing. No, because you have a nice Diet Coke and a sack of Twinkies at arms length to keep you going. And when they run out, you are easily able to replenish your supply and eat/drink as needed. Finally, you're not the one who has to face your ungrateful wife when your eturn from work and explain to her why you can't go to Jimmy's due to work calling you to do OT on the weekends and 10 hour shifts for the week after that! No you go home at 4:30PM sharp everyday and get to unwind in the comfort of your place and relax and eat/drink some more. Of course you turn on the TV and see that CNN is running an equality segment and right away you blast males for their insensitivity and bias of pay, rank and commission. The moral of this example is simple: While not all women fall into this catergory in mainstream working America, a majority do. I say this: If you want equal pay like men, get your sweet soft butts out there and work like one. Because no man is gonna give a secretary a Warehouser's pay like she is entitled to it when all she does is sit all day answering phones, plunking keys, filing data, breaking nails and popping chewing gum behind a desk while a man breaks his back in the heat and goes hungry and thirsty for the sake of his job. You want equal pay, we want you to do equal work. Get off your butt and hump those heavy boxes for 8, 10 or 12 hours in a day then you can demand equal pay. othersie, shut up and be glad you are being paid even $7.50/hour to do a job you are accustomed to. I ahve no sympathy for Feminism and it's leftist agenda. When I see women like my wife busting her butt with me in a factory and doing the same type of work I do, I will honor women more....not in the name of Feminism (screw leftists and their Socialist agendas....I am Conservative baby) but in the name equality. true equality. Because my wife is a real woman who does man's work and thus deserves a man's pay, rank and commission. And so she has my utmost respect and admiration. And I base a working woman's worth on my wife. If she can do it, as small and demure as she is, then any woman can if they wanted. Rememebr, like NOW (National Organization of Women) preaches...."we can do anything emn can do and better - no excuses, hands down, it is proven, we can". Then let's see it. Stop the leftist bitching and whining about what you don't have or think youa re entitled to and do like ym wife does....put your money where your big mouth s and prove it then! Talk is cheap! Don't sing it - Bring it! Then you will have what you ask! Fair enough? Let's hear it for those guys who bust their hump everyday regardless of conditions. How about a hand and respect for the select women who do a man's job and shuts the f*ck up about leftism and women's lib. When more women step into man's shoes and see what life is really like for us (not the easy street they think it is) then Women's Lib will be relegated to what it really is: a bunch of scorned fanatical man-hatning women who don't want equality, they want to reverse the roles with mena dn assume, not just authority and that which comes with it - oh no, those women want more....they want masterdom. Which is farther than anything equality if I ever seen it. Womens' Lib? Feminism? Socialism? Leftism? Democrats? Liberlism? Muahahahaha....get out of here and earn your rights for once! Hahaha! *laughs all the way to the bank with that* (edited by Jei*376 on 05-11-05 10:06 PM) |
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Arwon Zora Level: 35  Posts: 278/506 EXP: 278115 For next: 1821 Since: 03-15-04 From: Terra Australis Incognita Since last post: 5 hours Last activity: 10 min. |
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| That's one hell of a strawman. Did you build it yourself, with your MIGHTY MAN HANDS? |
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| Acmlm's Board - I2 Archive - World Affairs / Debate - International Women's Day |
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